Snakk

[Toasty]

He sure did:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10866824

To be fair, I think the media paraphrased his comments. It doesn't look like he said it directly.

[glasszon]

wow, I am speechless. I am so glad to be out of SNK already.

[lastmoa]

wow, I am speechless. I am so glad to be out of SNK already.

I'm not writing off Snakk yet .. way to early for that. Just not one of my major holdings but pleased to still be 'in the mobile ad space with Snakk and Vmob.

[Banksie]

To be fair, I think the media paraphrased his comments. It doesn't look like he said it directly.


That article propagates the misconception that that SNK is like XRO and DIL.



Kiwi tech entrepreneur Derek Handley is hoping his soon-to-be listed Snakk Media will follow in the footsteps of New Zealand's other technology listings. (my emphasis)

What he said was:

Handley said he wanted to follow in the footsteps of accounting software firm Xero and boardroom information provider Diligent in providing a high growth opportunity for investors.

which is not the same thing - he didn't claim SNK was a tech company, the NZ Herald did.

DISC: I don't hold Snakk and don't think they are a bad company - just not right for my risk profile.

[dsurf]

wow, I am speechless. I am so glad to be out of SNK already.

I am surprised that you are speechless - the disclosure document released to the market in Feb 2013 pretty succintly summed up the company:

"The Snakk business is not the subject of any fixed term contractual arrangements at this time and there are no
guaranteed recurring regular income streams for the Snakk business. Snakk is
not currently making a profit and is unlikely to do so in the near to
mid-term."

--If you want to play pass the parcel go to birthday parties with the founding directors - or just send me the cheque.

Is SNK the son of PLS PLS PLS give me the money - have no plan - no contracts - no revenue - no profit but buy me NOW!

[goldfish]

Yes as am I out now to, probably the wrong thing to do but I didnt know one guy could drive the price down like he is. I kept 5000 just in case and didnt lose much money as i bought them very low.
A lesson learned, I am new to all this, since fonterra floated was when I got in, made a lot of money from them got at 550 and sold at 800 cant complain at that. Made some money lost some money good times were had, I cant complain.lol
I hope the price does go back up though for all the holders.
I still think long term its got good potential I just not good at seeing the price crash, mainly due to one person to from what I have seen.

[Minerbarejet]

Lets all take a deep breath - in and out - in and out. Ahh thats better.
Now stop scaring the crap out of all the novices and new initiates.
This thing has only just listed and just because it didn't reach 25.00 in the first day of trading there's no need to get all dramatic. Not for anyone in particular but this thread has gone from positive to negative and is liable to blow a fuse ( probably at mrp) .

[Minerbarejet]

Think youlll find it reached 40 in the first day ;)
I was exaggerating slightly - it does say 25.00 meaning dollars
:)

[Minerbarejet]

well said, -its a long haul for this stock, however, once the basement gets cleaned out things should improve if they are able to deliver the goods.

[CJ]

Nothing has changed, its just frustrating seeing the SP depressed because of one person. That means lost opportunities to buy lower. In the end, everyone wants to make money!Doesn't it increase the opportunity to buy lower.

[Minerbarejet]

CJ , I would have thought so - then what the heck do I know
:)

[Huskeez]

He seems to be limiting himself to early morning trades, allow others to panic to depress the SP, others buy upwards again later in the day to increase SP then strikes again at the end of the day. The intraday chart is becoming VERY predicatable and makes me feel like I have deja vu; traders heaven here!

Traders heaven moosie? Really?

[ari]

has anything changed since you first invested? I'm not sure anything really has...hopefully it has, with SNK busy increasing income and decreasing expenditure and not wasting time reading our forum

[Huskeez]

How much opportunity for traders to sell above their buy price has eventuated during these days though. I agree the trend is there (but the volume is really light and most sales are going through at bid price). I just don't see it as a trading opportunity at the moment.

Agreed I would prefer to not spend 3k and hold 10% of the days traded volume

[RTM]

Thanks for this Moosie...

"(If you want to read the full run down on previous capital raisings, read pages 24-29 of this:
https://www.nzx.com/files/attachments/172066.pdf "

Well....I've learnt some lessons.

I guess this document was available for quite a while. I never took a look at it, and not sure I would have considered it in this way if I had. Personally I'd be pretty happy to buy shares at < 1cent and sell for anything more than 2 cents. And that risk was always there that this might happen.

So lesson I learn is to understand the ownership structure of the existing shares before going into something like this. Or/and be prepared to accept some fairly substantial risk in the early days if there are large shareholders who have purchased at a very reduced price.

Thanks all.
RTM

[Zaphod]

That article propagates the misconception that that SNK is like XRO and DIL.


I agree. IMO it's a hybrid tech/media company that leans more heavily to the latter, but it is definitely not the same thing as a pure SaaS company like XRO.

[robbo24]

I agree. IMO it's a hybrid tech/media company that leans more heavily to the latter, but it is definitely not the same thing as a pure SaaS company like XRO.

Think of it like the smartphone and tablet equivalent of Weta Workshop then!

[Minerbarejet]

Think of it like the smartphone and tablet equivalent of Weta Workshop then!
Hope the share price isnt going to be "propped " up - but I get the picture - without a lot of quality work in the background the end result wont be too flash.:)

[robbo24]

Appears Mr Sorensen is a bit reluctant to go below 12 so far, although he is just blatantly stacking them up above this. Buyer confidence has been thoroughly destroyed on this one.

I may be a little bit slow - what's he doing that is so bad?

[CJ]

I may be a little bit slow - what's he doing that is so bad?Holding back the share price which given Moosie has just changed from a trader to long term holding, is doing his head in. Taking a long term view, all it is doing is getting rid of one investor who doesn't want to hold and bringing a new investor that does.

Given the size of Sorensens holding, it is interesting that he hasn't been able to find a fund to take it off his hands in one go at a small discount. Must mean the likes of Milford, Superlife, ACC etc who aren't adverse to these small start ups aren't interested.

[Merc]

I may be a little bit slow - what's he doing that is so bad?

As a semi novice on the learning curve I couldn't figure it out either - until I went searching for a definition of what an SPP is and found this: http://blog.traderdealer.com.au/share-purchase-plans-spp/

[1leon]

Too much aimed at an assumption on Sorenson---plenty others must have 100,000 holdings from SPP. I had been attracted for sometime to follow Handley but was happy to escape late Friday/early this morning at cost of brokerage when comparing Snakk with MBE and MM for p/s and revenue and InMob for clients as well as vast number of shares out there.

[1leon]

Well aware of SSH--there was no basis for assumption that it was only Sorenson selling at start or end of any day or that 100,000 lots had to be his.

[Merc]

... Everyone who bought in above 12 cents is now deep in red because...

I hate to be the bearer of bad news here but ANY investment - a share, a property or a bar of gold - carries the risk of a drop in price.

Some of these drops may be terminal (company fails, uninsured house in a disaster, losing the bar of gold); others for a period of time due to a change in the relevant cycle or some other unforeseen reason. The drop maybe short term or it may be long term.

Rule 1 in life is Risk analysis. Consider the "What Ifs?" and have a Plan B

[1leon]

I don't doubt he may be the biggest seller (by far). But neither he nor the company might reasonably have expected the shares to be worth 12 cents within two years when they were issued at .9 cents. He (like a number of much smaller fry on further reflection) might think that price is not really sustainable. I can't really see the the point in theorising about his motivation or timing but do know mine. Look again at p/s compared to like companies with significantly greater revenue and client capture. And at least he is letting others get out with small destruction so far!

[robbo24]

Moose, have the fortunes of the company changed at all?

Do you still "believe in the story"?

The Moosie I know would normally be discussing blood in the streets and buy-buy-buying - what's different about this time Mr Moose?

[1leon]

I agree with almost everything you have said, but in terms of not seeing the point about figuring out who is selling and why, for me at least there is an obvious reason. IF like me you are someone sitting on the sidelines potentially looking to buy in, understanding what is happening to the SP and why is hugely important. At one stage I had a bid in at 12.1c but promptly withdrew that as soon as I figured out what was happening. Given that Sorenson picked up his shares at 0.9c he could easily drive the SP down a mile further. Even if you were really keen on SNK you would be a brave person to invest now with so much downside uncertainty. For those reasons I think the conversations re Sorenson are pretty relevant.
Otherwise like I said, agree with everything else you have said.
I didn't say there was no point in figuring out who the big seller was--his identity purchase price, sheer volume of shares and sell down were fact and relevant.I said there was no point in theorising on his motivation and timing-any discussion/negotiation with Handley, why he was selling after SPP or how far he wants to sell down we don't/can't know.

[bonne vie]

Have I missed something - why do you think Snakk Trustees Ltd got the shares for 0.9c. From the Snakk Media Ltd documents at the company office - Snakk Trustees Ltd does not appear on the Extensive Shareholder List dated 21/2/13 and the first Substantial Shareholder Notice was lodged at the Companies office 11/3/13 recording becoming a substantial holder (25,000,000 12.10%) 6/3/13 - the listing day. Therefore wouldn't the company's lowest purchase price be 6.5c or could he have purchased off market?
Still even at 6.5c - there was still 16,769,499 shares (6.58%) as ar 14/6/13 available to sell. Would be very interesting to have access to the 6/3/13 parcels sold.

[Snow Leopard]

Have I missed something - why do you think Snakk Trustees Ltd got the shares for 0.9c....

Go look (http://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?8953-Snakk&p=412377&viewfull=1#post412377)

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

[Tony Two Gloves]

I think Mr Handley has been very naive here in not having a lock up agreement for at least two years with the major holders (I think SLI did this) as would be the norm. I know he is a smart guy but did he believe verbal promises from Sorenson and Co that they were in for the long haul? I'm sure they didn't say hey Derek as soon as this thing lists we will be continually selling and driving the SP down so we can make a decent profit on our 0.009 purchase. If the major shareholders were locked in for two years I think the SP would be well up and Moosie wouldn't be jumping off Te Mata peak in his G String! Don't get me started on the continual issuing of securities at 0.05 & 0.065 when your new shareholder base just coughed up 0.12 - I am also now long term on this one which wasn't the original plan!

[bonne vie]

Thanks Moosie and PT. Sorry somehow missed that post - Yep see now.

[1leon]

I think Mr Handley has been very naive here in not having a lock up agreement for at least two years with the major holders (I think SLI did this) as would be the norm. I know he is a smart guy but did he believe verbal promises from Sorenson and Co that they were in for the long haul? I'm sure they didn't say hey Derek as soon as this thing lists we will be continually selling and driving the SP down so we can make a decent profit on our 0.009 purchase. If the major shareholders were locked in for two years I think the SP would be well up and Moosie wouldn't be jumping off Te Mata peak in his G String! Don't get me started on the continual issuing of securities at 0.05 & 0.065 when your new shareholder base just coughed up 0.12 - I am also now long term on this one which wasn't the original plan!
Sorenson has in fact been a holder for almost 2 years! This share issue well precedes the back door float. If Handley was sufficiently desperate for funds 2 years ago to issue shares at .9 cents he was in unlikely to have been in a position to dictate terms 4 years out.The real issue is the lack of transparency in back door floats accompanied by SPP.

[croesus]

Moosie... I take no pleasure in this debacle.

I have decided I will not hold you to our wager re your g string leap... I will instead in return for a bottle of H.B Red ( $20 to $30 ) range as my palate is State House... not Duart House.. allow you to retain your modesty.

Best regards.

Croesus.

[ari]

Don't get me started on the continual issuing of securities at 0.05 & 0.065 when your new shareholder base just coughed up 0.12
Don't forget this gem "This price represents an approximate 20% discount to the volume weighted average price of the last 30 days." ...Yeah right!

[GRIFFIN]

I'm out, this outfit looks way too dodgy for my liking quite happy to take a bit of a loss and put the money into something sounder.

[ari]

Mmm, well it was what the market was paying for the stock at the time!
Correct, but pity they didn't also advise the negatives, like that a certain gentleman has plans of stuffing it up for you:-)

[robbo24]

Can't prove intent if no crime is committed or knowledge obtained beforehand!

Moosie, the Companies Office website lets you look up director's addresses.

I dare you to write them an indignant letter.

This will save me the time copying and pasting your posts to the forum, printing them, then sending them myself :)

Go on...

[see weed]

i see there is 100,000 sitting at .115c, not taken out yet. is this the turning point? up...up...up we go on ' Air Snakk ' or down so we can buy some more. Very exciting. Don't forget there are 1,200 new share holders, how many were there before SPP? We could all jump in buy buy him out

[Baddarcy]

i see there is 100,000 sitting at .115c, not taken out yet. is this the turning point? up...up...up we go on ' Air Snakk ' or down so we can buy some more. Very exciting. Don't forget there are 1,200 new share holders, how many were there before SPP? We could all jump in buy buy him out

I was inclined to agree with you....but then this morning 450k sold on open and all the support is gone.

[ari]

I was inclined to agree with you....but then this morning 450k sold on open and all the support is gone.
Yep, support gone, but who is the keen buyer? Always two sides to the coin.

[goldfish]

Eek down even further.

[croesus]

Stop loss selling....will kick in shortly

[Toasty]

I feel bad but I jumped ship at 12. First time a panic sell worked in my favour....Normally I get burned on the upswing inspired by my sale.

[Minerbarejet]

I feel bad but I jumped ship at 12. First time a panic sell worked in my favour....Normally I get burned on the upswing inspired by my sale.
presumably you are going to buy back in at ? You say panic sell which indicates you may have sold at a loss. So would you buy the same number of shares that you had at a lower price or more shares for the amount that was forthcoming less brokerage

[False Profit]

This might look grim now but imagine the joy on our faces when it reaches XRO 'esque heights in the future! I'll be buying more when the current sell off bottoms out.

[bull....]

Don't get me started on the continual issuing of securities at 0.05 & 0.065 when your new shareholder base just coughed up 0.12

even at 10c these people are making nice money

[Minerbarejet]

This might look grim now but imagine the joy on our faces when it reaches XRO 'esque heights in the future! I'll be buying more when the current sell off bottoms out.
You wouldnt be related to Moosie by any chance?:)

[JohnnyTheHorse]

This might look grim now but imagine the joy on our faces when it reaches XRO 'esque heights in the future! I'll be buying more when the current sell off bottoms out.

You must be taking the piss? We've been through this already, the company is nothing like XRO and the share price will never be anything like XRO. SNK will never even get close to the margins that XRO can have and is far less scaleable. Yes, it may be a successful company in the future, but it will never be the massive multibagger that you are imagining in my opinion.

[MPC]

See the future of live sport viewing might be on mobile platforms such as phones and tablets. Imagine the advertising potential with millions watching the world cup etc. Something positive to help us through...
Cheers,
MPC

[lastmoa]

You must be taking the piss? We've been through this already, the company is nothing like XRO and the share price will never be anything like XRO. SNK will never even get close to the margins that XRO can have and is far less scaleable. Yes, it may be a successful company in the future, but it will never be the massive multibagger that you are imagining in my opinion.

I look on the drop as a positive for the markets in that it brings a sense of realism to the exchange when IT companies, such as Snakk, do IPO. Was getting silly with both SNK and SLI galloping away only to be brought down once the overexhuberence died away. I do not write-off Snakk, like some on this forum ... just that it will need time and the 'story' to develop. Both DIL and XRO took a while to gain momentum, and whilst I see SNK/SLI/VMOB, etc in a different light (like you Johnny) they are still tech and there respective IT marketplaces have large potential.
There will be more IT IPO's on the NZX and maybe we will now see a more tepid approach (DYOR) shown to them.

[Blue Horseshoe]

See the future of live sport viewing might be on mobile platforms such as phones and tablets. Imagine the advertising potential with millions watching the world cup etc. Something positive to help us through...
Cheers,
MPC

Well said MPC, this company has massive potential and that's why I am accumulating at these prices. :)

[Toasty]

presumably you are going to buy back in at ? You say panic sell which indicates you may have sold at a loss. So would you buy the same number of shares that you had at a lower price or more shares for the amount that was forthcoming less brokerage

I got out for what I paid so probably cost me the brokerage. Not a lot of thought in the sale though hence I class it as a panic sale. I am easily influenced by what I read. Sad but true.

Still watching though and may well be back in depending on what I read I guess....

[gv1]

[QUOTE=Toasty;412784]I got out for what I paid so probably cost me the brokerage. Not a lot of thought in the sale though hence I class it as a panic sale. I am easily influenced by what I read. Sad but true.
what have you been reading ? Any that we need to know?

[Xerof]

Just a bit of history for you, seeing this is being mentioned in the same breath as DIL

when DIL ipo'ed on NZX at $1.00, aside from the non-disclosure scandal that rocked the new shareholders, there were plenty of existing holders who were happily selling it down, 65, 55, 45, and they were making plenty due to being the seed capital at MUCH lower entry prices

it got to 7 cents eventually....before turning back up

Snakk appears to have a similar shareholder profile, so be cognisant of the fact that the current price of 10c means different outcomes to different shareholders.

[Blue Horseshoe]

I got out for what I paid so probably cost me the brokerage. Not a lot of thought in the sale though hence I class it as a panic sale. I am easily influenced by what I read. Sad but true.

Still watching though and may well be back in depending on what I read I guess....

Toasty, take everything on this forum with a grain of salt, there are people running the stock down to buy it cheap, just like there are people talking it up in an attempt to drive the price up.

[GRIFFIN]

I think croesus prediction of 9c may well be on the money, why would a fledgling company with a whole lot of new share holders go and knock their confidence out of the water with an overhang like this.

[goldfish]

Very true Xerof. At this rate and based on previous share raisings I could see the SP going towards, if not hitting, 5 - 6.5 cents. Carnage appears to be far from over yet.

If it drops that low ill be getting some more. Still think they could be a great long term investment.

[blah]

Yes it seems that the sentiment on this forum regarding Snakk is based on how the share price rides. Post the SPP, people were talking of Snakk rising to $x (free T-shirts) etc... then a shareholder sells down and the share price drops and things go custard. As mentioned before by others, there is no change in Snakk's story and future potential (if any) by a shareholder selling down. Also note that Mr Sorensen invested early on when Snakk was still in its infancy - a high risk phase - so it is more than natural for him to sell out and pursue other high risk opportunities.

Sure Snakk is not a Xero, Diligent based on what they do and so there will be implications regarding future revenue, margins etc. But then again the comparison with XRO and DIL was never valid to begin with so I'm not sure why there is disappointment regarding this. Even if the comparison with DIL and XRO is not favourable, that does not affect Snakk's own prospects. If we still believe in the Edison report (which we did when the share price was a bit higher than what it currently sits at), Snakk is forecast to make a small profit in 2014 and a $2m profit in 2015, from losses at the moment.

I can understand people becoming nervous when the share price has fallen quite a bit below the SPP, but if you believe in the Snakk story as you had before, then Mr Sorensen selling out is really just a one off event that shouldn't have any influence whatsoever on this story. If you don't believe the Snakk story that is another issue. I must admit myself that I am reevaluating my investment decision in Snakk - but thinking about this objectively rather than emotionally, there is no reason to doubt my optimism that I had before in Snakk.

At the end of the day, people will believe in what they want to believe in. People may bash me for saying something they don't believe in, and that is fine. I do feel for those who bought in based on the optimism - the cheap talk - portrayed here though. And for those who are worried - be more worried considering Seadragon (who produces fish oils) selling out of Snakk (an advertising company) is just a matter of time.

[Banksie]

Yes it seems that the sentiment on this forum regarding Snakk is based on how the share price rides. Post the SPP, people were talking of Snakk rising to $x (free T-shirts) etc... then a shareholder sells down and the share price drops and things go custard. As mentioned before by others, there is no change in Snakk's story and future potential (if any) by a shareholder selling down. Also note that Mr Sorensen invested early on when Snakk was still in its infancy - a high risk phase - so it is more than natural for him to sell out and pursue other high risk opportunities.

Sure Snakk is not a Xero, Diligent based on what they do and so there will be implications regarding future revenue, margins etc. But then again the comparison with XRO and DIL was never valid to begin with so I'm not sure why there is disappointment regarding this. Even if the comparison with DIL and XRO is not favourable, that does not affect Snakk's own prospects. If we still believe in the Edison report (which we did when the share price was a bit higher than what it currently sits at), Snakk is forecast to make a small profit in 2014 and a $2m profit in 2015, from losses at the moment.

I can understand people becoming nervous when the share price has fallen quite a bit below the SPP, but if you believe in the Snakk story as you had before, then Mr Sorensen selling out is really just a one off event that shouldn't have any influence whatsoever on this story. If you don't believe the Snakk story that is another issue. I must admit myself that I am reevaluating my investment decision in Snakk - but thinking about this objectively rather than emotionally, there is no reason to doubt my optimism that I had before in Snakk.

At the end of the day, people will believe in what they want to believe in. People may bash me for saying something they don't believe in, and that is fine. I do feel for those who bought in based on the optimism - the cheap talk - portrayed here though. And for those who are worried - be more worried considering Seadragon (who produces fish oils) selling out of Snakk (an advertising company) is just a matter of time.

Well put blah.

[see weed]

If it drops that low ill be getting some more. Still think they could be a great long term investment.

Good afternoon passengers, welcome to 'Snakk Air' We are about to land at 5pm. to let off some air sick people , and to pick up some new passengers. We hope you enjoyed your flight and will fly with us again at a later date and at a discounted fair

[Minerbarejet]

Yes I agree, very well put Blah.
I;m not sure how you could be a true believer in the story without knowing those details..... You could ask the same question of millions of Muslims and Christians - its called faith

[blah]

Yes I agree, very well put Blah.
The trouble with "the story" is that no-one has ever seemed to know the details about what SNK does exactly (the technical details of their mobile advertising campaigns) and why they better than the rest, or even any good at all?
I've tried to find out for my self and have also put out this question out there several times on the forum and no one seems to know. I;m not sure how you could be a true believer in the story without knowing those details.....

I believe, though admittedly not 100% sure, that they are a niche advertising that focuses only on mobile marketing. Correct me if I'm wrong - much of this may be made up or extrapolated from bits and pieces of other things that I might have read. From my understanding: companies approach them, and through partnerships with advertising companies, to conjure up a marketing campaign. Snakk designs and or implements this, delivering the ads or whatever though a network of ad space that app developers have in their apps, the media and telcos. I think this bit is mentioned in the Edison report:

"Snakk Media earns its revenues from the brand owners indirectly via the media agencies they employ to place their campaigns. It has developed trading relationships with seven of the 10 leading media agencies in Australia. Those media agencies are choosing to use Snakk for its ability to deliver appropriate, targeted audiences of sufficient scale, which it does in partnership with:
 major media owners, such as Fairfax, APN and BBC Worldwide;
 network operators; and
 app developers."

Edison seems to believe that Snakk is better than its competitors because they have better customer targeting analytics. I'm not sure I believe this, or even so I don't put much weight on it. Rather, I see the advantage Snakk has over others is in the relevant experience of their leadership team, and the contacts that they would have accumulated over the years who may well become potential customers. Also bear in mind that Handley has Branson amongst his contacts. I may be dreaming, but if Branson happens to drop some pocket money into Snakk in the future that would be much like Theil investing in Xero.

In any case, even if Snakk does not become an advertising mogul, if it can successfully capture even a small slice of the booming mobile advertising space, that may be enough upside potential for me.

That is how I understand the Snakk story. I admit I don't know the full details and probably have misinterpreted bits and pieces, but I'm happy to hear other people's version of the Snakk story, be it a better or worse story.

[Zaphod]

You're right, Snakk designs a demographically targeted mobile campaign using their analytics software.

Whether or not Snakk is better at this than their competitors is up for debate. Even if Snakk's targeting algorithms are "better", they can only provide targeting information that is as good as their data set can provide and let's face it, some of their competitors will have access to much larger and more detailed pools of data. Snakk also need to ensure they are on top of content delivery technology, methods and trends, maintain relationships with key advertising agencies, directly with publishers wishing to monetise their content through ads and have the critical mass of mobile advertising spots that are needed to secure customers.

But that is not to say that Snakk can't pull this off. The mobile advertising market is growing immensely as old mediums are quickly cannibalised and new mediums emerge (e.g. in-game advertising), coupled with the fact that Australasia is served mostly by relatively small companies like Snakk. A few high profile successes, an acquisition or two later, perhaps the faltering of a competitor and it could very well be on top.

[The Real Bud Fox]

Finally there's some talk about the company's prospects rather than theorising on 'large' blocks of 100,000 shares trading hands.

For goodness sake, the company has a market cap of +$25m. The volumes don't really justify pages and pages of comments.

Maybe for a day or two we park our theories on 'large blocks being dumped' and concentrate on deciding whether the Company has long term prospects. As Zaphod commented above, it's in a market that is growing exponentially so, hey, that's a good start.

[boofters]

With the latest moves in Online content --> Colesium purchase of EPL I believe affirms SNK business model.
Mobile is the future for content distribution, no argument, the more content= more viewers = the greater need for corporates to targeting these viewers with campaigns built for these platforms.

[CJ]

For goodness sake, the company has a market cap of +$25m. The volumes don't really justify pages and pages of comments.

Maybe for a day or two we park our theories on 'large blocks being dumped' and concentrate on deciding whether the Company has long term prospects.Depends if you are a trader or a long term holder. What is relevant for one, may or may not be relevant for another. As long as it is on-topic, I dont think you can complain.


People will post what they want to post Bud,

[Minerbarejet]

Finally there's some talk about the company's prospects rather than theorising on 'large' blocks of 100,000 shares trading hands.

For goodness sake, the company has a market cap of +$25m. The volumes don't really justify pages and pages of comments.

Maybe for a day or two we park our theories on 'large blocks being dumped' and concentrate on deciding whether the Company has long term prospects. As Zaphod commented above, it's in a market that is growing exponentially so, hey, that's a good start.
Welcome to sharetrader Bud, you have made a rather dramatic entrance I must say. We will be looking forward to further comments from you. Cheers :)

[goldfish]

Lol. I like reading all the speculation and talk going on in this thread, its lots more interesting reading then others.. Down to 10.1 now. How low will it go?

[Minerbarejet]

Lol. I like reading all the speculation and talk going on in this thread, its lots more interesting reading then others.. Down to 10.1 now. How low will it go?
There is a croesus point at .09 which we are monitoring.:)

[goldfish]

Getting close then...

[RTM]

Both veins of discussion are worthwhile....IMO. But unless I understand why they will succeed a bit better, I won't be placing any large bets on them. So watching and waiting, however long that might be.

Ditto re the Goldfish comments....it is entertaining ! Especially as 0.09 approaches...eh Moosie !

Cheers
RTM

[Tony Two Gloves]

Normally I think averaging down is a fools game, so why am I feeling tempted.......

[Snow Leopard]

Normally I think averaging down is a fools game, so why am I feeling tempted.......

Probably best that none of us answer this.

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

[artemis9]

I believe, though admittedly not 100% sure, that they are a niche advertising that focuses only on mobile marketing. Correct me if I'm wrong - much of this may be made up or extrapolated from bits and pieces of other things that I might have read. From my understanding: companies approach them, and through partnerships with advertising companies, to conjure up a marketing campaign. Snakk designs and or implements this, delivering the ads or whatever though a network of ad space that app developers have in their apps, the media and telcos.

That is how I understand the Snakk story. I admit I don't know the full details and probably have misinterpreted bits and pieces, but I'm happy to hear other people's version of the Snakk story, be it a better or worse story.

Snakk is not an agency - it is essentially a blind network. While an ad network owns its own platform, Snakk has licensing deals with more than one platform (eg. Millenial Media) and has the flexibility to choose the appropriate platform to deliver different types of mobile ad campaigns (eg. video, rich media). There is plenty of info online explaining the difference between an ad network and a blind network.

The creative part of the equation is not part of their revenue stream - it's thrown in for free. What Handley learned from his Hyperfactory days is that there is no scale in mobile marketing so when an media agency pays Snakk $60k for a mobile campaign it doesn't take 3x the work of a $20k campaign. It's about delivering results - eyeballs - not time for money.

Publishing deals are a crucial part of the business which is why Big Mobile suffered after losing News Ltd. This deal got picked up by Inmobi. The better the publishing agreements the greater the reach. I'd be wanting to know what new licensing agreements Snakk has landed recently that give it a competitive edge. As far as what Snakk does, they are closer to Inmobi than anyone else in the space.

[1leon]

Snakk is not an agency - it is essentially a blind network. While an ad network owns its own platform, Snakk has licensing deals with more than one platform (eg. Millenial Media) and has the flexibility to choose the appropriate platform to deliver different types of mobile ad campaigns (eg. video, rich media). There is plenty of info online explaining the difference between an ad network and a blind network.

The creative part of the equation is not part of their revenue stream - it's thrown in for free. What Handley learned from his Hyperfactory days is that there is no scale in mobile marketing so when an media agency pays Snakk $60k for a mobile campaign it doesn't take 3x the work of a $20k campaign. It's about delivering results - eyeballs - not time for money.

Publishing deals are a crucial part of the business which is why Big Mobile suffered after losing News Ltd. This deal got picked up by Inmobi. The better the publishing agreements the greater the reach. I'd be wanting to know what new licensing agreements Snakk has landed recently that give it a competitive edge. As far as what Snakk does, they are closer to Inmobi than anyone else in the space.
Thanks Artemis. After all the postings here it is at last great to have a pointer as to where value might need to llie rather than chant Handley like a mantra.I had no idea of the layers in advertsing. I have now looked at blind network and really still don't grasp the practical ramifications.What is the nature of the publishing/licencing agreements --how does Snakk get get them (buy?)and are they for fixed terms( years?). Is there any intellectual property unique to Snakk or Handley that gives any additional edge? And is this sector proven to be sensationally profitable anyway?

[RTM]

Hey Moosie
Remember this ?

Croesus
"Not wanting to rain on Moosies parade, but even more confident, after this announcement I will have the option of paying 9 c. "

and

"If you're right I'll go paragliding off Te Mata Peak in my underwear. If I'm right you have to come jump off Bluff Hill in the same fashion "

So anything under 9.4 c would round to 9c....correct ?
I'm down in the Bay start of next month.....can you let me know when you decide to proceed ? Be nice to pop out to Te Mata for some entertainment. Hate to miss it !
:)
All the best,
RTM

[croesus]

Moosie....I have no doubt you are a man of your word....

I think to be 100% fair... I will not claim my wine... until we reach 8.9c

Hopefully, when that happens, you will then let me buy you a beer... and we can discuss the vicissitudes of the market place.

Cheers.

[gv1]

[QUOTE=croesus;413232]Moosie....I have no doubt you are a man of your word....

I think to be 100% fair... I will not claim my wine... until we reach 8.9c

Oh, what a shame we won't have the pleasure to see someone leaping naked.....ha! ha!

[Baddarcy]

Shoot me for being positive.....but isn't SNK actually holding up fairly well over the last couple of days compared to other stocks.

I mean right now SNK is down 1% where TEL, WHS , KMD, DIL (for a broad mix) are down a heck of a lot more than that.

[Minerbarejet]

Shoot me for being positive.....but isn't SNK actually holding up fairly well over the last couple of days compared to other stocks.

I mean right now SNK is down 1% where TEL, WHS , KMD, DIL (for a broad mix) are down a heck of a lot more than that.
Actually Snakk was the only green bit on my abbreviated watchlist when I last looked.

[Kiwi]

Anybody for a cheap Snakk? Good value, while stocks last.

[see weed]

Anybody for a cheap Snakk? Good value, while stocks last.

yeah why not. .101 and maybe .091 to help moosie out

[ari]

H E L L O......MOOOSSSIEE
hope he hasn't jumped, I've got nothing to read!

[1leon]

H E L L O......MOOOSSSIEE
hope he hasn't jumped, I've got nothing to read!
Perhaps try Xero?

[Baddarcy]

Looks like the 100k man is back..

[Minerbarejet]

Whew that was close Moosie - down to 9.5 there for a moment:)

[see weed]

down to .095c , calling mr. handley and the B team . more positive news please. we don't want Moosie to loose his pants.

[GRIFFIN]

So right moosie looks like sub 9c not far away with little buying interest at the moment.Needs some very positive news to fire it along.

[see weed]

This guy just isn't going to quit until his lot has dried up. Be VERY careful if you are buying right now people.

too late, got some yesterday for .101

[Toasty]

too late, got some yesterday for .101

Ouch. Could have got some for .1009.

[see weed]

it would be nice if mr. handley had a special wee meeting to welcome all the new shareholders, and to say thank you for all that financial support we have given him and the "B TEAM". we can all sit down and have a nice cup of tea & cake and celebrate the birth of a new company. how many shareholders do you think can fit into.....Suit 205 Ironbank...150 Karangahape rd....Auckland?..ph+64 274 762 556

[kizame]

Mr Sorensen is offering up another 100K people, look sharp. This guy must be desperate to sell dumping 100K on top of a 10K bid. Ah well, he is the maker of his own loss of profit when others were buying at up to 17 cents before he dumped. Ijuit if I ever saw one...

Moosie. Let it go already. Who cares,I'm in for the longer run with this,contrary to my usual stance,so what if he's selling,someone is lucky enough to be buying.

[gv1]

Moosie. Let it go already. Who cares,I'm in for the longer run with this,contrary to my usual stance,so what if he's selling,someone is lucky enough to be buying.

How about all of us buying him out?

[Zaphod]

What concerns me the most at this point is the lack of information flowing from Handley and how thinly he has spread himself across so many endeavors. Quite frankly, he needs to take a leaf our of Rod Drury's book.

[ari]

B Team news
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10893166

[CJ]

What concerns me the most at this point is the lack of information flowing from Handley and how thinly he has spread himself across so many endeavors.Handley is Chairman (and Founder), not CEO. You should be looking at Mark Ryan (CEO) and Andrew Jacobs (GM and Founder) to be driving this forward.

http://investors.snakkmedia.com/?page_id=15

[goldfish]

Id rather he concentrate on growing his business for his shareholders who have invested there money into him, instead of trying to save the world. At least for the moment.

[ari]

Id rather he concentrate on growing his business for his shareholders who have invested there money into him, instead of trying to save the world. At least for the moment.
I agree...quotes from article " At the same time our collective life has been re-imagined as a market, driven by the pursuit of short-term profit. These two trends have placed us in danger."
" to safeguard the future by moving beyond short-term thinking, a focus on limitless growth and profit at all costs, and to "find their moral backbone".
Total reversal for Branson,...... Handley, just don't know where he is going with this...

[Minerbarejet]

Lol, pig latin. Couldn't soup kitchen airported it my beehive. :t_up:
Sure you havent opened that wine bottle already. Good to see you are still laughing- I thought you were feeling mooserable.:)

[Zaphod]

Looks like Snakk is coming in for some ribbing from the Whaleoil blog.

http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2013/06/lorem-ipsum-invest-with-us/

I don't know if you or anyone else noticed, but that place-holder text has been left in various parts of the website for quite some time, for example on the analytics page http://snakkmedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Analytics3.jpg

While it's not out of the ordinary for this to be done for sites under construction, I'm surprised it's been left there for so long.

[Zaphod]

Handley is Chairman (and Founder), not CEO. You should be looking at Mark Ryan (CEO) and Andrew Jacobs (GM and Founder) to be driving this forward.

http://investors.snakkmedia.com/?page_id=15

Good call. So why are they silent to our requests? A rhetorical question I know.

[bunter]

also this...http://investors.snakkmedia.com/terms-conditions/

[Balance]

Moosie. Let it go already. Who cares,I'm in for the longer run with this,contrary to my usual stance,so what if he's selling,someone is lucky enough to be buying.


So said those who felt lucky and were happily bought heaps of Plus SMS, New Image, Certified Organics etc?

[Balance]

Too right. Wouldn't you feel bad kizame if you had been conned into buying a pair of shoes at one retailer for $350, then realised someone had dumped a massive shipload of them on the market and everywhere else around town was selling them for $25 a pair? Would you not feel a little spiteful towards that retailer and the person who did that, and knowingly so?

Sorry, Moosie-me-ole-mate, have to disagree with you there.

This is the age of the internet, of instant information and even more important, of abundant information.

If someone chooses to go and buy a pair of shoes for $350 when a simple search of the internet will reveal that the retailer is very good at selling cheap shoes at expensive prices, I say all power to the retailer.

It is all in the packaging and I suspect those who bought at $350 looked at the packaging rather than the shoes?

[Banksie]

It is all in the packaging and I suspect those who bought at $350 looked at the packaging rather than the shoes?

I like it, good advice when buying shares...look at the shoe not the packaging :).

[Balance]

Fair game then, guess I had a bad analogy then (is there even one for this situation???). I did buy a pair of shoes a few weeks ago, went to another store and saw them for twice the price. All power to me then.

Exactly!

I bought a Samsung for my son after a quick search of the internet showed I could buy from a parallel importer who has a big presence (retail) and been in business along time for over 25% cheaper than from Telecom or Vodafone.

Sadly, many out there still pay the full price to these two mobile operators.

[Balance]

Ever notice how the 100K on the bid side at 10c, 9.5c, 9c etc have a habit of disappearing or getting reset at lower levels as the selling moves down?

[GR8DAY]

......someone placing "dummy" buy orders trying to give the impression of a support level, then pulling the order cos they dont really want to own them..........i guess??

[Zaphod]

Exactly!

I bought a Samsung for my son after a quick search of the internet showed I could buy from a parallel importer who has a big presence (retail) and been in business along time for over 25% cheaper than from Telecom or Vodafone.

Sadly, many out there still pay the full price to these two mobile operators.

As far as parallel imported phones or other cellular connected devices are concerned, if you have the technical know-how you should update the firmware on them to that which is used by the telco to which you are subscribed. There are some differences in the firmware (e.g. fast dormancy) on imported models that can cause relatively minor issues such as the battery to draining quickly.

[CJ]

Or maybe he thinks that 10c is fair value so has instructed his broker not to go below that amount.

[Balance]

Could be. Whatever the limit is, the market ain't buying into it. This issue needs to be resolved before we can see any uptrend in Snakk.

Plus SMS, Aquaria 21, Certified Organics, New Image etc - many have reasons to regret the lure of easy money spun by the masters of spin.

[Minerbarejet]

Anyone else suspicious that there is some sort of agreement that Sorenson wont sell down below 10c? Correct me if I am wrong but he hasnt sold down that far right? It just seems a bit odd that within minutes any ask above 10c is snapped up but there is a block sitting there at 9.5c (for some time now) that Sorenson does not appear to want. The guy would nab an easy 10 bagger selling at 9.5 so it seems a bit odd to me given recent events.
Assume you mean bid and not ask and it does seem very odd I agree if it is him and if they were bought at .009:)

[Minerbarejet]

Oops, yup any "bid" at or above 10c gets eaten up real quick.
wasnt being picky - just couldnt make head nor tail of it for a while:)

[Balance]

Maybe - the timing of it all is just a bit fishy - unless there were restictions on selling I am not aware of, it seems he had ample chance to sell at much higher prices before the SPP, and even after for a bit.
It is fair to expect that SNK should have been aware of and in communication with their large shareholders and what those shareholders intentions were? Particularly with the SPP in mind? My hunch is that SNK is aware of all this and an agreement may have been made re the 10c limit. All massive speculation of course ;)

That will have to be disclosed to the market.

If it is not, it tells you of what you are dealing with.

[Balance]

Hi Balance, so I'm new to this so could you explain a bit?
Are you saying that any agreement re price limits for large holders selling down must be disclosed?
Cheers

Absolutely!

[GRIFFIN]

The early dealings with this new company really look a bit odd in the way its unfolding to this stage, I'm sure a lot of shareholders are perplexed to what is going on from the management side who must be driving this ship.

[Balance]

Cool cheers, and what about your sense of what happens in reality? I.e. do these guys chat about this sort of thing behind closed doors and wink wink nudge nudge an informal agreement is effectively made which is not disclosed?

Honestly haven't got a clue with this crowd.

[Balance]

Could there be some manipulation of the share price prior to the SPP to make the offer look more attractive and then what happens to the price post offer ?

Good question.

[etrader]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/companies/inmobi-seeks-100m-local-piece-in-expansion-puzzle/story-fn91v9q3-1226672808458

[gv1]

ah, good old inmobi. they want 1/3 of the aussie market, and I don't doubt they have the money to do so. the question is can snakk do it better and take their slice of the cake when it comes down to it?

Are they actually doing anything or just sitting with the money( capital raising).?

[gv1]

No new news out from the company yet. I'm sure we will find out in due course. I suspect this will be an attempt to head-off inMobi's incursion into the Aussie market as Snakk needs a homebase in which to operate, with Aussie being its first home and NZ second.

Thanks Moosie

[1leon]

Ouch! Is that the first sign of a big seller (likely Sorenson) dipping below the 10c mark? Either way its a little concerning as it looked like a floor of about 10c had been established.
Actually the early trades looked unreal-the market started buy 10.5 and sell 10.3! Needless to say the 10.5 buyer filled at start.

[see weed]

sorensen looks to be dipping again. i have been in contact with management and may be posting communication regarding this issue soon and when it suits all parties involved. stay tuned...

same here, but i will let you do the communicating. it would be silly if we all communicated. also looking forward to any updates. have you bought any more lately, at these lower prices?

[spotty]

same here, but i will let you do the communicating. it would be silly if we all communicated. also looking forward to any updates. have you bought any more lately, at these lower prices?
Didn't this guy do the same with CER also. I'm quite keen on the concept as I think this mobile platform advertising captures the right audience. My kids have their faces buried in their smartphones all day long, not to mention the countless folk walking down the street, faces buried walking into lampposts - there ya go medical insurance advert! Been sitting watching this one for a while but feel its more based on good idea but not the right people involved in the company. Still going to keep watching.
Disc not holding SNK

[Dentie]

Thanks, I am trying to speak for everyone here so all good. I have not been buying recently as I am tied up in another company right now and trying to get this down selling stopped before it destroys everything for this company!

....and the selling goes on.....

No chance of this firm being over valued, that's for sure!

Where's Rod when you need him.

[Minerbarejet]

think I'll come back in a couple of years and see what happened with this one. Its bottom drawer for you Mr Snakk. Next!
:)

[ari]

think I'll come back in a couple of years and see what happened with this one. Its bottom drawer for you Mr Snakk. Next!
:)
Yep, same for me.....but lets face it, to rise to the values it did was all on rhetoric and hype, they had done fek all!

[Tony Two Gloves]

sorensen looks to be dipping again. i have been in contact with management and may be posting communication regarding this issue soon and when it suits all parties involved. stay tuned...

Can you give us any further news Moosie? God knows we need some good news before this thing gets consigned to the Penny Dreadful Sorenson Stable!

[GRIFFIN]

With all those 100,000 plus blocks for sale on the sell side its going to get way worse before it gets better, and its shot itself in the foot credibility wise as well.

[see weed]

go talk to management at 150 Karangahape rd. Suit 205. They seem pretty positive.....Max Flanigan or ..CEO Mark Ryan

[zigzag]

Also, and it has been mentioned before, but isn't Sorenson technically allowed to do what he wants with his shares? What can Snakk or anyone else do to stop him selling on market? Obviously they can work out an agreement with him, but technically he can do as he pleases with his own shares, can't he?

I agree turmeric. I can see no reason why Mr Sorenson cannot sell his shares for whatever price he chooses. Seems like the only thing he has done wrong is to rain on moosies parade.

[Toasty]

Ouch 8.5 cents. I sold all at 12cents but due to an oversight I have 600 shares left..haha.

Isn't it bottle of wine time for Croesus, Moosie? Or are you still jumping off Te Mata peak pantsless?

[Minerbarejet]

not in this weather I hope-good on you Moosie for giving them a hoe up.
:)

[Tony Two Gloves]

go talk to management at 150 Karangahape rd. Suit 205. They seem pretty positive.....Max Flanigan or ..CEO Mark Ryan

There is no way my wife will ever allow me to go to that Road ever again!!!

[ari]

Lets just hope the balance of the 6.5 is tucked away earning something!

[1leon]

I agree turmeric. I can see no reason why Mr Sorenson cannot sell his shares for whatever price he chooses. Seems like the only thing he has done wrong is to rain on moosies parade.
I also agree. Those carried away with the idea that Sorenson (or others) must commit to some unknown (unlimited?) escrow agreement might like to look at Synlait float where the ecrow agreements are only approx a year and also permit sales within that time with a limit in quantlty but no limit on price.

[Huskeez]

I agree turmeric. I can see no reason why Mr Sorenson cannot sell his shares for whatever price he chooses. Seems like the only thing he has done wrong is to rain on moosies parade.

Surely with you guys being "investors" you had an exit strategy in place prior to investing with this company incase **** hit the fan?

[see weed]

Care to share?

email from Mark..... Please feel free to get in contact with me at any time, we're very happy to share how things are moving along (as much as we can) with our investors. Many thanks...M My reply..........Hi Mark. Thank you for your email. I am concerned with the weakening share price over the last few weeks since SPP. My investment is down about 27%. Can you please tell me if there is any positive news for the future. I am feeling a bit deflated. Many thanks......me.

[see weed]

Cheers mate, I appreciate your response. And have they said anything to you re the sell down?

i only sent the email today to Mark. But last week Max said things were going alright and said earlier share holders took the risk and just want to get a bit of profit out.

[Blue Horseshoe]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/unlimited/8699474/How-Derek-Handley-is-taking-on-the-world


I missed this last week, did anybody else read it.

[robbo24]

good on you guys, keep the pressure up. I haven't received a reply from derek yet but I can tell you he is taking it seriously as michelle kong and tim alpe were cc'ed into my email from him.

Smash them Moosie

[zigzag]

I think 6.5c is a fair price to issue the options at. It is the current shareprice that is way over the top. It is the pricing of the SPP that is the critical issue. If they want to get a good takeup it should be priced at 6.5c. Anything more and I wouldn't be as keen, and anything over 10c and I would give it a miss.

Moose, you should have listened, instead of ramping up the price, like it was even better than sliced bread. Mr Sorensen probably is thinking that "everybody deserves at least one moose in their lifetime"

[Blue Horseshoe]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/5661910/Investment-company-embroiled-in-bitter-battle


Hey Moosie, must run in the family.?

[K1W1G0LD]

Moosie..............................happy enough when the share price is going up, but don't like it going down..........................get used to it . Thats what happens with sharemarkets .Your rampant paranoia is boring too. Put your money in the bank!

[Balance]

kiwigold, if the sp was going up significantly due to insider trading, like RAK or BBG, i would be all over that too. its about ETHICS, not money.

im trying to get guidance and transparency regarding this issue (I will post the communication between myself and handley when it is ETHICALLY proper). this isn't for just me, its for the shareholders and the market at large

Matey, me thinkth you feel you have been ramped and dumped on?

Next time, read carefully the history behind those who bring such wonderful offerings of blue skies to you.

[Balance]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/5661910/Investment-company-embroiled-in-bitter-battle

[gv1]

kiwigold, if the sp was going up significantly due to insider trading, like RAK or BBG, i would be all over that too. its about ETHICS, not money.

im trying to get guidance and transparency regarding this issue (I will post the communication between myself and handley when it is ETHICALLY proper). this isn't for just me, its for the shareholders and the market at large

Hi Moosie,
Good on you mate. If the Co is going ok, then there is no problem with SP but if something else is going on, then it's a big concern.

[gv1]

thanks for that balance. installing his own buddies in the job again eh? sorensen is a scourge upon the market and everyone should know it. never, ever will I buy into any company remotely linked to him...

Yeah, Me too.

[Banksie]

thanks for that balance. installing his own buddies in the job again eh? sorensen is a scourge upon the market and everyone should know it. never, ever will I buy into any company remotely linked to him...

A cautionary tale on naming directors in public forums.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10896757


Hotchin and Watson are suing and seeking $7 million plus costs from Sheppard over what a judge called "severely critical" comments he made about the pair on television, radio, emails and on blogs concerning their involvement in Hanover's collapse.

[robbo24]

A cautionary tale on naming directors in public forums.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10896757

[/FONT][/COLOR]

It's not just a matter of naming directors - this is a civil claim for defamation.

The most obvious example of defamation is an allegation of criminal conduct - I can't see any allegations of criminal conduct.

Sure, defamation can include statements that lower the reputation generally, but there's still the question of what damage this has done and how compensation would be quantified...

I see your point Banksie, but I would assume the allegations made in this matter far surpass the mating call of a wild moose... Gotta watch those allegations of insider trading though [given that it can be an offence....]

[steve fleming]

Meanwhile, over at MBE

"In a New Zealand first, Berocca in partnership with Mobile Embrace has created the first mobile-led consumer sampling campaign that uses the native functionality of the iPhone to deepen audience engagement and drive product trial. "

"The campaign will run across m-sites and apps on Mobile Embrace’s premium local and global publishing partners including New Zealand Herald, The Radio Network and TVNZ. "

http://stocknessmonster.com/news-item?S=MBE&E=ASX&N=744515

Free Berocca's are offered as part of the campaign, so hope everyone keeps an eye out for it!

[etrader]

Any value in MBE and snk merging or takeover ?

[steve fleming]

Any value in MBE and snk merging or takeover ?

As a large MBE shareholder, that would be my worst nightmare

[janner]

Having followed the posts ..

Barge pole material in my opinion..

[see weed]

more buyers coming in....incoming , watch your flank and rear guard . Buyers building up. Is this the turning point? or a dead kitty bounce. Better buy some more just in case. Up over 10% in 2 days so far today.......will it hold or is it a fizzer

[Balance]

more buyers coming in....incoming , watch your flank and rear guard . Buyers building up. Is this the turning point? or a dead kitty bounce. Better buy some more just in case. Up over 10% in 2 days so far today.......will it hold or is it a fizzer

Saw the same thing happened with Plus SMS.

So ask yourself this question - are you buying short term price movements or long term share price growth?

[baller18]

more buyers coming in....incoming , watch your flank and rear guard . Buyers building up. Is this the turning point? or a dead kitty bounce. Better buy some more just in case. Up over 10% in 2 days so far today.......will it hold or is it a fizzer
it always fizzles at 0.1...
Disc - holding in the hope for long term share price growth

[baller18]

Baller, you have ballz of steel ;) good luck with your investment.
Im telling myself the same thing, bought in at 0.12... lol... speculate - speculation - speculating is all I can say atm haha

[see weed]

Saw the same thing happened with Plus SMS.

So ask yourself this question - are you buying short term price movements or long term share price growth?

bit of both. Some times it ends up long turm ..eg..fpa ,air & pgw. i had cer, chrome,ephone,itc, cadmus,herry gold,new call, fletforest years ago, all turned to s..t. But one day one might take off.

[winner69]

All I can say is don't buy above 10 cents right now.

I wish I could be the bringer of good news but Handley still hasn't written a reply to me. He must really be thinking this one through...

Do you really think he cares moose

[Snow Leopard]

The Moose's "recommendation" is don't buy above 10 cents right now.

I wish I could be the bringer of good news but Handley still hasn't written a reply to me. He must really be thinking this one through...

Probably speaking to his old mate Richard, "Hey, you get some weird complaint letters (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/travelnews/4344890/Virgin-the-worlds-best-passenger-complaint-letter.html). What the hell do I do with this one".

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

[1leon]

Still confused who you are saying is acting unethically and why?
Likewise, but I'm guessing its got something to do with protecting people suffering from hype.

[see weed]

The Moose's "recommendation" is don't buy above 10 cents right now.

I wish I could be the bringer of good news but Handley still hasn't written a reply to me. He must really be thinking this one through...

Moosie, try emailing ceo Mark Ryan......mark.ryan@snakkmedia.com

[kizame]

I really hope they are too busy building this company to answer too many emails right now.
I would hope there is just too much to do,this little company has only just completed a capital raising,and one big shareholder has decided to sell,so all this doesn't last forever,the company now has plenty of dosh,so i just tend to think,
Shut up,sit back and let the company do it's stuff.
I bought a few thousand bucks worth after the capital raising as an interesting investment,not a trade,and so far it has been interesting,haha. With an investment or trade the buck stops with you,if you don't like what's happening get out,if you believe in management then stay,simple as that.
I will give them a decent chance.

[lastmoa]

I really hope they are too busy building this company to answer too many emails right now.
I would hope there is just too much to do,this little company has only just completed a capital raising,and one big shareholder has decided to sell,so all this doesn't last forever,the company now has plenty of dosh,so i just tend to think,
Shut up,sit back and let the company do it's stuff.
I bought a few thousand bucks worth after the capital raising as an interesting investment,not a trade,and so far it has been interesting,haha. With an investment or trade the buck stops with you,if you don't like what's happening get out,if you believe in management then stay,simple as that.
I will give them a decent chance.

Well said. I like the potential of the mobile advertising sector so happy to hold this and others in the same space, on NZX/ASX. Time will tell who makes good headway. In meantime I am not writing off Snakk either, just unsure.

[croesus]

Just finished reading " Heart to Start " by Derek Handley. Have you Moosie ? Very interesting read... especially between the lines.

Will lend it to you if you like, when we catch up for that Beer.

Will be offline for a month as have decided to visit the Hungarian F1 and the Nestle WRC...in Finland... so leaving in a few days...

Regards .

[etrader]

When would we expect 1st quarter sales to June. We will be looking for 80 percent gain over same quarter last year to keep the growth similar before the percentage increase pull back.

[croesus]

Cheers Moosie... I thought 3 or 4 would be enough......

[Copper]

Over the last week it is good to see some genuine buying orders and by the look Mr Sorenson has taken a back seat.With a buyer of 150000 it has set the tone hopefully. Kizame some good comment a day or two back.
Regards..

[see weed]

Over the last week it is good to see some genuine buying orders and by the look Mr Sorenson has taken a back seat.With a buyer of 150000 it has set the tone hopefully. Kizame some good comment a day or two back.
Regards..
Hi Copper
Welcome to the forum. I am new to, but have been reading it for about 4 years. Have you got Snakk shares?

[Copper]

Thanks see weed.I looked at this forum years ago and really forgot about it until I bought some Snakk shares .For lesser known shares it's a good place for that little bit of info you don't get in the market place.With all the restrictions on statements by directors it's a wonder we ever get anything these days.I have Xero and they started at a dollar,went to 1.20 and then fell apart to 68 cents.This thing is showing the same trends.We only need some regular positive info and some good staff hirings and we may be on our way,all be it at a lesser pace. Let's hope.

[J R Ewing]

To me, an important difference between Snk and Dil is that Dil had a clearer product so that even at listing one could understand how they planned to generate future profits.

After 90 pages of this thread I don't see where anyone has explained how Snk is going to make profits. So maybe $25 mil market cap is pretty good money for those selling shares in this start up.

[Copper]

Hi J R...Good comment.I think that the Company,s stock exchange announcements of 25 march and 4 June give some idea.I admit that this forum doesn't help.Nineteen out of twenty investors don't know the forum even exists.In my opinion by taking 6 mill. From SPP they took away 4 mill of short term buying cash and should have somehow taken Sorenson out at the time if he was in fact a seller.He has depressed the share price over time.The 6 mill. is a large amount over original target so points to taking over a company I think. Regards....

[see weed]

To me, an important difference between Snk and Dil is that Dil had a clearer product so that even at listing one could understand how they planned to generate future profits.

After 90 pages of this thread I don't see where anyone has explained how Snk is going to make profits. So maybe $25 mil market cap is pretty good money for those selling shares in this start up.

Every time an ad is served across Snakk's Media network, Snakk clips the ticket and makes money. Revenue comes from the advertiser paying to use the space or the publishers serving the ad to its audiences - or both. To find out more , go to....snakkmedia.com

[see weed]

I really hope they are too busy building this company to answer too many emails right now.
I would hope there is just too much to do,this little company has only just completed a capital raising,and one big shareholder has decided to sell,so all this doesn't last forever,the company now has plenty of dosh,so i just tend to think,
Shut up,sit back and let the company do it's stuff.
I bought a few thousand bucks worth after the capital raising as an interesting investment,not a trade,and so far it has been interesting,haha. With an investment or trade the buck stops with you,if you don't like what's happening get out,if you believe in management then stay,simple as that.
I will give them a decent chance.

I fully agree with your post 100%. You don't have to hope for what they are doing, they are doing it. I will be buying more on the price dips. You never know, we could all be in for a pleasent surprise in the future.

[see weed]

ps. back to weeding garden on such a fine day.

[Balance]

Every time an ad is served across Snakk's Media network, Snakk clips the ticket and makes money. Revenue comes from the advertiser paying to use the space or the publishers serving the ad to its audiences - or both. To find out more , go to....snakkmedia.com

Sounds more and like Plus SMS everyday!

[winner69]

Sounds more and like Plus SMS everyday!

What.s Plus SMS Balance

Was that the outfit that was to get zillions everytime some texted or something

[see weed]

Here is your chance Moosie and everybody. To ask some questions face to face........Snakk annual meeting.....26/6/13

[see weed]

Here is your chance Moosie and everybody. To ask some questions face to face........Snakk annual meeting.....26/6/13

Sorry wrong date...... Snakk annual meeting....26/8/13

[Copper]

At least the tone of the announcement feels ok.We will see no doubt at the meeting.

[Zaphod]

What.s Plus SMS Balance

Was that the outfit that was to get zillions everytime some texted or something

Plus SMS: Lots of hype, no delivery. The whole thing descended into a bazaar farce, most of which is detailed here: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10753959

Take a good long read of the article, noting some familiar names and their actions.

Let's not forget that Snakk has (IMO) a viable business model. I hope they get the execution right and that the board & management team aren't interfered with.

[baller18]

Plus SMS: Lots of hype, no delivery. The whole thing descended into a bazaar farce, most of which is detailed here: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10753959

Take a good long read of the article, noting some familiar names and their actions.

Let's not forget that Snakk has (IMO) a viable business model. I hope they get the execution right and that the board & management team aren't interfered with.

Oh wowwww!
Making me think twice about dumping snak now, especially Sorensen, not cool at all. Heard way too much about the sorensen's. After reading the article, makes me think snak has been all about hype. Thinking hard to dump snak or not. However, I still have some faith in handley.

Disc - holding

[ari]

Take a good long read of the article, noting some familiar names and their actions.


Thanks for that Zaphod, missed that one....and as you say 'The names' yep the line up is there!

[1leon]

Oh wowwww!
Making me think twice about dumping snak now, especially Sorensen, not cool at all. Heard way too much about the sorensen's. After reading the article, makes me think snak has been all about hype. Thinking hard to dump snak or not. However, I still have some faith in handley.

Disc - holding
I suggest you re-examine the basis for faith in Handley by looking at the article post 1284 by Bluehorseshoe on p. 86:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/unli...g-on-the-world.
I find alarming Handley's idea that he will expose investors to "multiple Snakks..... which might not all work".
" Part of the reason for Snakk being on the exchange is to try to create a new kind of listed company that is small cap, high growth, small revenue tech stock that isn’t looking to raise tens and tens of millions. It’s almost using the NZAX as a venture capital source for A round and B round type capital.
My dream would be to start creating multiple Snakks and popping them on the exchange one after the other, enabling the general public to get a piece of the action. They might not all work, but I think every investor should be exposed to these types of exciting journeys."
It seems to me he is getting carried away by his own hype.
Discl quit at loss of brokerage.

[baller18]

I suggest you re-examine the basis for faith in Handley by looking at the article post 1284 by Bluehorseshoe on p. 86:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/unli...g-on-the-world.
I find alarming Handley's idea that he will expose investors to "multiple Snakks..... which might not all work".
" Part of the reason for Snakk being on the exchange is to try to create a new kind of listed company that is small cap, high growth, small revenue tech stock that isn’t looking to raise tens and tens of millions. It’s almost using the NZAX as a venture capital source for A round and B round type capital.
My dream would be to start creating multiple Snakks and popping them on the exchange one after the other, enabling the general public to get a piece of the action. They might not all work, but I think every investor should be exposed to these types of exciting journeys."
It seems to me he is getting carried away by his own hype.
Discl quit at loss of brokerage.
Hey Leon, yup have read this article before, thanks for the heads up.
I think these questions need to be addressed at the meeting.
Just how is he planning to raise all these so called 'high growth companies' is beyond my imagination. Why is he not just focusing on snakk?Lets say some faith was a bit on the optimistic foolish side, more like slightest faith.

[baller18]

Moosie your thoughts on handley?

[1leon]

Hey Leon, yup have read this article before, thanks for the heads up.
I think these questions need to be addressed at the meeting.
Just how is he planning to raise all these so called 'high growth companies' is beyond my imagination. Why is he not just focusing on snakk?Lets say some faith was a bit on the optimistic foolish side, more like slightest faith.
Actually I bought on the basis he apeared signally motivated and personally impressive and the market might like that. Like some others here I could not come to grips with what Snakk owned i.e. it was not obvious what if any intellectual property might be unique to it. It also appeared increasingly obvious Handley was doing a lot of other things. There was no point in riding down with the fall. I think Sorenson is largely a distraction. If indeed there was "value" there there should have been keen buyers for those shares. It seems to me less a question of destroying value than doubting there is much value there, at least at this point.

[etrader]

Interesting comments guys above - thanks for the link of the herald article. It's good sorenson is selling out we don't need his name on the list by the look of it, he's made his ten bagger and is off to vmb now.

If you look at the hype of plus vs snk my view is they're not all hype be it only north of 4 mill in sales but they have a real business with real sales and from the announcements to date are telling investors it's a long term stock to be patient for this emerging media.

I'm interested mostly in quarterly sales growth and where they will deploy the capital raising - if its only used for cash burn over two years I don't think we will see a share price north of .20c

Just my views guys DYOR

[Copper]

.....This sounds like "big day out" at the lemming community.If all you base your shareholding in Snakk on is what Plus SMS did then you won't be a holder in Snakk.If at the Annual Meeting you can convince yourself that Handley passes muster and that they have a good business plan and are currently making money,then that's what its all about.Sorenson appears to be on the way out,not in and they have enough cash in kitty as against issuing zillions of shares.Let's get a bit of stability in the show.We'll be bringing up Brierley,Judge and Hawkins next..........

[Copper]

Well said etrader . Sorry missed your post while doing my one.I don't mind going from 10 to 20 cents but think there is a chance of better if sales trend continues.People luv cheap stocks.
Regards.....

[see weed]

From Mark Ryan last week..... Completely understand your concerns, we're going to be providing information to our investors and the broader market soon. Until then i appreciate your patience; and assure you that Snakk is absolutely in the right space, and at the right time, and the entire team is working hard to make the most of the opportunities in front of it....M

[CJ]

Hmmmm, distracted...?He's the Chairman, not the CEO.

A chairman of a NZX10 company can hold 5-10 other large directorships and still have time to play golf 3 times a week.

[J R Ewing]

So the guy everyone is counting on to deliver the growth and profits isn't the CEO, just chairman? And he plans to split his time between several of these tech startups and still has time to go on holiday? Hmmm...

[CJ]

So the guy everyone is counting on to deliver the growth and profits isn't the CEO, just chairman? And he plans to split his time between several of these tech startups and still has time to go on holiday? Hmmm...
NO - they are also relying on Branson who has nothing to do with the company at all.

Disc : I will be looking at this company once the downward pressure starts to ease. People thought it was worth over 20c at one point so no reason why it cant get their again.

[Copper]

I went back over the history of Snakk and all it's beginnings.Can someone confirm or otherwise whether my thought that Sorenson was a shareholder in Claridge cum Cer etc and got his Snakk when Claridge gave in specie distribution of 20% Snakk original shares .He thus was not an original subscriber to Snakk ,just got there by default.He may have been part of the original shenanigans but not a recent addition.Any help appreciated.
Regards....

[whatsup]

I went back over the history of Snakk and all it's beginnings.Can someone confirm or otherwise whether my thought that Sorenson was a shareholder in Claridge cum Cer etc and got his Snakk when Claridge gave in specie distribution of 20% Snakk original shares .He thus was not an original subscriber to Snakk ,just got there by default.He may have been part of the original shenanigans but not a recent addition.Any help appreciated.
Regards....


No not from there, I think that he was one of the semi original seed capital share holders.

[see weed]

Concerns about Sorensen is it See Weed?

I don't know. That email was in response to my email, that can be viewed on page 86 post no.1280

[J R Ewing]

You are right Copper, he was a Claridge holder, just look at previous article on Plus SMS debacle (sorry CJ, read again). He specialises in backdoor listings and pumping and dumping. He has put more money in at much lower prices plus during the SPP, but this was obviously just to trade them off for a higher price.

So why would a reputable company with sound prospects need or want to get involved in this type of listing and with these people in particular? VIL did a back door listing without any of these shenanigans.

[Snow Leopard]

...He has put more money in at much lower prices plus during the SPP, but this was obviously just to trade them off for a higher price.

Gosh, how unethical, buying something to sell at a profit later. :eek2:

Of course, none of us would do such a despicable thing.:mellow:

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

[Copper]

So why would a reputable company with sound prospects need or want to get involved in this type of listing and with these people in particular? VIL did a back door listing without any of these shenanigans.

Some not very savory persons often have good ideas.In this case the listing goal fitted the bill.If you look at the original shareholders there are some high profile people,some of which would like the listing to realize some cash.Pretty orthodox really .You have to look at the result and not the personnel involved.

[Balance]

Some not very savory persons often have good ideas.In this case the listing goal fitted the bill.If you look at the original shareholders there are some high profile people,some of which would like the listing to realize some cash.Pretty orthodox really .You have to look at the result and not the personnel involved.

First rule of investing is look at personnel involved!

[Balance]

Gosh, how unethical, buying something to sell at a profit later. :eek2:

Of course, none of us would do such a despicable thing.:mellow:

Best Wishes
Paper Tiger

PT - you are speaking for yourself, obviously?

"He specialises in backdoor listings and pumping and dumping. He has put more money in at much lower prices plus during the SPP, but this was obviously just to trade them off for a higher price."

[Copper]

First rule of investing is look at personnel involved!

Totally agree Balance but I recall Equiticorp,Judgecorp,Chartercorp,Chase and Rainbow just to name a few .Even Brierley. Followed to the man.No one gave a second thought to the possible demise of all of em.....Sorenson etc seem to be the last diehards trying ever so hard to finally lay all the skeletons to rest.They would have been better as liquidators .IMHO.

[Balance]

Totally agree Balance but I recall Equiticorp,Judgecorp,Chartercorp,Chase and Rainbow just to name a few .Even Brierley. Followed to the man.No one gave a second thought to the possible demise of all of em.....Sorenson etc seem to be the last diehards trying ever so hard to finally lay all the skeletons to rest.They would have been better as liquidators .IMHO.

Sorry but I do not get your point.

[Copper]

Sorry but I do not get your point.

Sorry Balance.Trying to mean that when you said ',firstly look at the personnel involved,"if you went back to the eighties and you religiously looked at the then successful business people all of the ones in by post all came to a sorry end.Am hoping we have a successful ride with the new breed at Snakk.Time will tell.

[robbo24]

Still no reply from Handley. He needs to get off it and get this sorted before the AGM...

Hide ya wife, hide ya kids...

[baller18]

Funny how no trades have gone through today...
Thought Sorensen would've been keen to off load at 10cents...

[Copper]

Don't tempt it matey, he snapped up that 10 cent bidder late in the day yesterday. Anything above 10 is most likely his, and those blocks at 10.4 and 10.5 are already in place...

Has anyone the foggiest clue whether the selling blocks now are in fact Sorensons.? If he gets taken out privately or reduced to a hold position then if Handley at the AGM sounds a very positive note we could see a good move in price.By all accounts the only seller has been Sorenson and stock has to come from somewhere.There have been a good lot of buyers over the weeks who wouldn't have heard of this website.

[1leon]

.By all accounts the only seller has been Sorenson and stock has to come from somewhere.There have been a good lot of buyers over the weeks who wouldn't have heard of this website.
If you read some of the posts you will find other sellers. The question you need to adress is what has Snakk got to justify any such price. Just because the market is big does not guarantee Snakk can do well in it let alone make a profit. Meantime Chairman,co founder and frontperson has gone for his Summer holiday!

[gv1]

This is my last post on this thread as I see it as a huge waste of time! Sell, sell, sell!!! Not sure if I could be any clearer!

Not yet..
Big growth in Kiwis shopping on mobiles.. NZ herald.

[Copper]

This is my last post on this thread as I see it as a huge waste of time! Sell, sell, sell!!! Not sure if I could be any clearer!

You would be that person walking out of a ground in disgust only three minutes into the game when the ref penalized your team....

[janner]

And in my opinion, don't buy at all. Take a look at RYM, DIL and PEB. :)

So why did you .. If you did !!..

Disc. Didn't..

[Balance]

You would be that person walking out of a ground in disgust only three minutes into the game when the ref penalized your team....

Or the person who moved from Christchurch to Sydney 2 days before the quake.

[J R Ewing]

You would be that person walking out of a ground in disgust only three minutes into the game when the ref penalized your team....

Or the person that bought tickets for Manchester United but realized after three minutes that it was Mansfield Town playing in scarlet shirts.

[see weed]

This is my last post on this thread as I see it as a huge waste of time! Sell, sell, sell!!! Not sure if I could be any clearer!

No, it is not your last post on this thread.....You will not be able to resist coming back in for a comment.....The opposite to pump and dump is ......deflate and accumulate.... Please don't leave us so early and bright on this beautiful Snakk morning.

[baller18]

the SNAK thread has turned into a laughing thread... lol

[Blue Horseshoe]

the SNAK thread has turned into a laughing thread... lol

Yep, snak holders will be laughing all the way to the bank.:D

[robbo24]

Or the person who moved from Christchurch to Sydney 2 days before the quake.

There's lots of money in Christchurch for those of us who stuck around.

[Dentie]

Got my Snakk letter from Mr H today. Some insights in it for some I expect.

Certainly doesn't sound like he is doing what the Italian "Captain Coward" did to those who put their trust in his steering abilities....!!

[Dentie]

care to share dentie, please?

Sorry Moosie. I just took it that shareholders would have also received their letter from Mr H. It is a letter advising about the Annual meeting on 26 August "at a time and venue to be advised". It advises of nominations for Director etc. Quotes as follows...

"Our new office in NZ and expanded Australian sales regions are going well, and our strategy post the SPP remains focused on growing revenues, exploring strategic investments and developing partnerships"

"We encourage shareholders to take a long term view on the future opportunities of the business. It operates in a very young but extremely fast growing market, and Snakk is determinedly positioning itself for sustained success"

"We are excited about the future, as we have consistently been since the listing and thank you for your continued support".

Apart from not knowing yet where the AGM will be held ... rest of it is encouraging - considering all the negative stuff around Sorenson's involvement.

[see weed]

Sorry Moosie. I just took it that shareholders would have also received their letter from Mr H. It is a letter advising about the Annual meeting on 26 August "at a time and venue to be advised". It advises of nominations for Director etc. Quotes as follows...

"Our new office in NZ and expanded Australian sales regions are going well, and our strategy post the SPP remains focused on growing revenues, exploring strategic investments and developing partnerships"

"We encourage shareholders to take a long term view on the future opportunities of the business. It operates in a very young but extremely fast growing market, and Snakk is determinedly positioning itself for sustained success"

"We are excited about the future, as we have consistently been since the listing and thank you for your continued support".

Apart from not knowing yet where the AGM will be held ... rest of it is encouraging - considering all the negative stuff around Sorenson's involvement.

Also in the letter..........In accordance with NZAX Listing Rule 3.2.2 the nominations period for the appointment of a Director is open and the closing date for nominations is 5:30pm, Friday 2 August 2013. Nominations may only be made by a shareholder entitled to attend and vote at the Annual Meeting and must be accompanied by consent, in writing, from the nominated person. Director Nominations should be sent to; Malcolm Lindeque, Chief Financial Officer, Snakk Media Limited, North Harbour, Auckland 0751, PO Box 302430........... So there you have it. It would be really nice if somebody nominated Moosie for that job. How about it Moosie, you sound very trustworthy. Better you than one of the majority shareholders.

[Dentie]

Also in the letter..........In accordance with NZAX Listing Rule 3.2.2 the nominations period for the appointment of a Director is open and the closing date for nominations is 5:30pm, Friday 2 August 2013. Nominations may only be made by a shareholder entitled to attend and vote at the Annual Meeting and must be accompanied by consent, in writing, from the nominated person. Director Nominations should be sent to; Malcolm Lindeque, Chief Financial Officer, Snakk Media Limited, North Harbour, Auckland 0751, PO Box 302430........... So there you have it. It would be really nice if somebody nominated Moosie for that job. How about it Moosie, you sound very trustworthy. Better you than one of the majority shareholders.

Yes Moosie - how about it?

[Balance]

I'd usually expect 2-3 days of selling (especially on major down days when tech/spec stocks get hammered), followed by a rise again. The selling certainly isn't huge and buyers are keeping the price buoyant. I think this might be the only chance to get in below 14, but I would wait until the end of the day for capitulators to come to the fore.

Sorry, Moosie, you are playing with the big boys with decades of experience at how to make fast money.

Stop digging and climb out of the hole.

[Minerbarejet]

Sorry, Moosie, you are playing with the big boys with decades of experience at how to make fast money.

Stop digging and climb out of the hole.
Think he may have climbed out already especially if he didnt get a letter, eh moosie.:D

[Minerbarejet]

they may be more experienced and bigger, doesn't mean I can't cause them some grief along the way though!Moosie, moosie, let me ask you a couple of questions.
a. when you buy and sell shares for whatever reason would you be expecting any input from Mr S on what you should or should not do?
b. Stop loss a bit tight was it?:)

[1leon]

Moosie, moosie, let me ask you a couple of questions.
a. when you buy and sell shares for whatever reason would you be expecting any input from Mr S on what you should or should not do?
b. Stop loss a bit tight was it?:)
And just to help us see your own approach on share ethics against the background of your postings 2 more questions Moosie:
c. how many shares did you have
d. when did you sell.

[Minerbarejet]

a) If I had aas many shares as Mr S, I would expect him to be worried that I was down selling as much as he is. If we were part of the same company/shareholding, talks would definitely be ongoing!
b) Stop-loss was never a loss, exited with a slight gain when I knew it was going downhill fast. I have an amazing knack for getting out before losing too much. Can't say the same about getting in unfortunately...



c) I had over 150,000 shares at one point.
d) Sold the vast majority the day before it went under 12 cents. Was watching depth and trading very closely, i can tell you that!
Thank you for your honesty, moosie. I do feel you are tilting at windmills though trying to influence something that is neither illegal nor in my humble opinion unethical. He owns the shares and he is entitled to sell them whenever and to whomever he feels like at whatever price he feels like. Sticking my neck out I would say that he probably feels OK about you doing that. Dont worry so much - look at NTL in AUS with over 6 mil on hand now down in the 5s - we'll just keep chipping away.
Kindest Regards
MBJ
Trust you all survived the shake

[1leon]

[QUOTE=majorbarejet;417801]Thank you for your honesty, moosie."
Well obviously I am reading a different page. It seems to me that have been at least 3 occasions on which Moosie should have clearly disclosed that he had sold out.This bluster for the last month about ethics when any reading in the area would at chapter 1 have included his own disclosure leaves me cold. And if I need to qualify myself I speak against a background of investing longer than Moosie has been on this planet and with commensurate professional and other experience in allied fields

[1leon]

Why and when was it that he should have disclosed that he sold out? Precisely what is it that he owes you information wise? I'm a little wary of accepting at face value comments from anonymous people who beat their chests so loudly over other people's alleged failings.

Its been pretty clear from close enough to day 1 than Moosie was interested in and held Snakk.
Sorry that I appear to have beaten my own chest. I was simply endeavouring to establish that I was not as new to investing as my number of posts could possibly suggest.
As to anonymous there hardly seems to be anyone posting who uses an identifiable name.
As to loudly it is moosie that who has been ranting about ethics for a good month now. I have posted once on this.
I agree that it was clear from the outset Moosie had an interest in Snakk.However it was only in the last two days majorbet twigged to the fact he had sold out. He has been the preeminent advocate for investing in it.He has also indicated he feels some obligation to others who may have invested because of his enthusiasm. I did not invest because of his enthusiasm and he owed me nothing in information, wise or otherwise. Those who did, might feel they would have liked to have he had sold. Since you feel wary about my commenting there seems little to be gained in spelling out the detail for you when I feel disclosure was called for.

[Schrodinger]

Sorry that I appear to have beaten my own chest. I was simply endeavouring to establish that I was not as new to investing as my number of posts could possibly suggest.
As to anonymous there hardly seems to be anyone posting who uses an identifiable name.
As to loudly it is moosie that who has been ranting about ethics for a good month now. I have posted once on this.
I agree that it was clear from the outset Moosie had an interest in Snakk.However it was only in the last two days majorbet twigged to the fact he had sold out. He has been the preeminent advocate for investing in it.He has also indicated he feels some obligation to others who may have invested because of his enthusiasm. I did not invest because of his enthusiasm and he owed me nothing in information, wise or otherwise. Those who did, might feel they would have liked to have he had sold. Since you feel wary about my commenting there seems little to be gained in spelling out the detail for you when I feel disclosure was called for.

So you invested in a company because "Moosie" was positive about it?

Can anyone say - Finance company collapse? A case of advisors etc recommending things that the investors had no idea about, then blame the advisors.

You need to engage your brain and work things out for yourself.

[lastmoa]

[QUOTE=1leon;417819]

Well I'm so very sorry for trying to protect others investments and help the little guy out. Last time I do this kind of thing. No wonder the young and experienced are put off the sharemarket...

Cheer up, Moosie.
If I am correct that you sold out, I am surprised at that. Patience is a virtue.
Unlike many here, I am not writing off Snakk, at this early stage, by any means.
I like the space they are operating in .... just unsure who the clear winners will be, so am gladly holding my Snakk and ignoring the recent SP 'noise' Pleased to hold a few players in the mobile advertising space and expect some collateral damage as the sector plays out over the year ahead.

[Schrodinger]

It is good to read these forums for the information to get up to date on companies. I dont tend to take any notice of who is holding what as I do my own research.

[Balance]

Dear XXXX,


Hope you are well.


We did a market announcement recently updating the market and shareholders as to where the company is at and some things on the horizon, which in essence covered off our view on the situation you raised.

Regarding your specific question, from the advice I have received, we are not necessarily able to direct or interfere with how shareholders plan to sell or buy their holdings, or what kind of a time horizon they choose to view the business.

We are monitoring the situation on going and if there is a way we can facilitate any thing that is in the longer term interests of all the shareholders, without breaching any NZX or other rules, then of course we will look at those options closely. However, I can't imagine there is anything you can do (referring to your comment about 'work with you') to assist this personally.

The market will continue to value the stock as it does, and because we are a small cap, with a few large holders, sometimes there will be volatility and demand or supply pressure (in either direction) that disproportionately affects the stock price.

Thank you for following up with me,
Regards
Derek

For an entrepreneur and someone who is supposed to have gone through the rough and tumble of the corporate world, Handley's reply is unconvincing.

Of course he can make a binding agreement to have a shareholding lock-up especially when he chose to use the backdoor/compliance non-prospectus listing route.

In fact, that is the usual practice of any self-respecting company - more so the case for an IT company which requires time to establish market presence and credentials.

He cannot be so naive not to know that.

My guess is that it is all too inconvenient to agree to a lockup as it could well impact upon the shareholdings of directors and management as well.

BTW - well done, Moosie - good letter. Sharetraders should be very grateful and appreciative of your initiative.

[CJ]

As I have said before, my investment is on hold until Sorensen is sorted. This is going to be harder to ascertain once he drops below the 5% threshold. Right now, my money is elsewhere.Probably wise. Its a shame he cant find a trade buyer for his shareholding. Maybe if the company wasn't so greeding in accepting so much oversubscription on the SPP, he would have been able to sell??

I note your letter to DH referred to the Business Bakery. I dont think there is any connection between Sorenson and business bakery???

[Balance]

I don't, IPO's are a mugs game. Sparky is right - there are early signs of the mugs returning to the markets.

All the warning signs were there.

[1leon]

So you invested in a company because "Moosie" was positive about it?

Can anyone say - Finance company collapse? A case of advisors etc recommending things that the investors had no idea about, then blame the advisors.

You need to engage your brain and work things out for yourself.
You should take your own advice and engage your eyes as well. I clearly stated I did not invest because Moosie was enthusiastic. If you read my post 1349 you will find I set out both my reason for investing and subsequently selling.Neither was based on Moosie's views- in fact my reason for selling was somewhat in opposition to Moosie's view that there was some real value in Snakk. Like Moosie, it now appears,I have no loss to blame anyone for.

[Balance]

Moosie, you could say that "by working with me" was in terms of seeking the FMA and NZX to investigate the transactions for any insider benefit. But since he doesn't want to be helpful, you will put that in your letter to Tim Bennetts and the new FMA guy.

Not holding my breath, STC.

NZX is only interested in revenues (remember Plus SMS and how NZX was going to more proactively tackled the shenanigans around back door listings?) and FMA is asleep at the wheels (gave David Ross a big tick as an AFA despite written warnings!).

NZX is managed for the benefit of its shareholders and its CEO - nobody else.

FMA was put in place to quieten down the outcry due to the 'tits and perks' era of Plane Jane - so far, it has not acted in some very obvious cases.

[1leon]

I respectfully disagree. If you are going to accuse Moosie of something unethical, I think you ought to explain what it is. It's not me personally that needs an explanation, but you who owes it by making snide assertions.

Personally I think Snakk isn't much chop and has a number of unappealing facets. On top of that, I don't understand the business model well enough. So I never understood why Moosie liked it. But that doesn't mean we gang up on him when he discovers reasons why the stock sucks and he wants answers from the company on the points he raises.
I clearly said my view was that disclosure of his selling was the ethical issue. I wasn't asking anyone to gang up on him. I,like some other posters, do not believe Sorenson had some ethical obligation to not sell down. I have also posted that that is simply a distraction from whether Snakk has value. As to when Moosie might have disclosed his sale I think he ought to have disclosed it at least when he made it, for the benefit of those he himself feels under an obligation. It would seem to me he had little, if any, obligation unless some were holding on the strength of his enthusiasm. In addition I suggest he should have made disclosure 1. when there was discussion of whether people other than Sorenson were selling,2) when he was asked if he was buying (his response was that he wasn't buying more) 3) when he said he was taking a stand for all shareholders. However I do not want to keep banging on about this when you don't personally want my explanation anyway.

[Minerbarejet]

Having read a lot of Moosies comments throughout these threads there appears to be no doubt that he is a trader. Probably short term. He is entitled to be a trader and can sell or buy as he wishes. He s renowned for his enthusiasm and no doubt makes a bit of money as a result. He spends a lot of time on charts and is willing to share what he discovers with all the others here. He either unwittingly or very subtly made a disclosure when he asked dentie to share his letter from Handley. Having received one myself there was only one conclusion- Moosie was not on the books. Having done the odd short term trade myself it seemed possible that he wisely had set a tight stoploss that was ahead of the purchase price and this had been activated. Personally I think
that he would like to get back in for more trading but is blocked by a big seller in the meantime and is making whatever noise he can to get it shifted along. I cant for the life of me see anything unethical about this from either Moosie or Mr S.
Disc: Holding 30000 Snakk purchased of my own free will and with my own money.
No sharetraders or anyone else should feel under any obligation for this decision.
Regards to all

[CJ]

Sorensen never pumped the stock. A certain Moose was very enthusiastic to borrow Majors term.


lol, that's a good assumption Major. I can assure you I am not trading anymoreI can assure you the IRD would take a different view should they be bothered to look at your affairs. Even all your 'long term holds" (or are they "long term trades") are in companies that have never paid a dividend which makes it more likely than not, especially given you previous short term trader status, that you are purchasing with the intention of profit on resale. Not saying you are any different from most of the people on this forum, just pointing out that length of holding is irrelevant.

[Copper]

lol, that's a good assumption Major. I can assure you I am not trading anymore (other than OGC today because of the PoG). I hold DIL and NTL long-term and if SNK gets the Sorensen issue sorted I will hold that long-term as well. That is the extent of my portfolio. If things change, my portfolio will change. I don't have time for constant day-trading anymore and am confident holding those stocks long-term will be better than trading them constantly and making my broker rich. I have seen the light and am now (mostly) a slothful

investor :)
Well said....If some of the smart traders on this site had traded Xero over a period they would have all lost most of their capital or made very little.The share price was to volatile and if you weren't watching it at all times of day you would have been caught in the recent $13 to $18.70 to $14.50 to $17.20 by the time you had a coffee.I can see Snakk being one of those similar stocks that will move rapidly often unexpectedly and you don't have time to get in or cover.It's hardly a trading stock yet as we have only travelled through a settling down period.From here on with the AGM ,Sorenson exiting and some hopefully favorable announcements we may be on our way.To make comments about not knowing the space they are in or even whether the Company is in it begs belief.You have to be basically a term holder and a believer or not be in at all.

[gv1]

[QUOTE=moosie_900;417882]We've already been over this, and I talked to the IRD this year as well as my fathers accountant.
With IRD, it can never be trusted.
They can come down 5-7 yrs later and reassess your returns even it was audited, someone more qualifed then the current one.

[Balance]

From here on with the AGM ,Sorenson exiting and some hopefully favorable announcements we may be on our way.To make comments about not knowing the space they are in or even whether the Company is in it begs belief.You have to be basically a term holder and a believer or not be in at all.

No one should have any problems whatsoever with Sorenson and what he is doing.

Backdoor listing companies and selling out after they list is his game and he does it very well.

"Part of the investment, $5.7m, is being paid for in 10 monthly instalments to interests associated with John Sorensen, an Auckland investment broker who specialises in backdoor listings. Sorensen had held the shares since organising New Image's backdoor listing through Selector Group in 2004.

Asked why he sold his shares, he told the Sunday Star-Times: "Same reason a dog licks its balls."

The question to be asked is why Snakk chose to use his services, given his track record.

[Minerbarejet]

memo to self : do not invite Mr Sorensons dog around for dinner.

[baller18]

Weird how Sorenson is not selling anything under 10 cents atm...
Time will tell

[Balance]

Weird how Sorenson is not selling anything under 10 cents atm...
Time will tell

If you believe in Snakk, take the opportunity to buy at under the SPP price.

Why worry about short term selling? It's just a dog licking its balls - after the itch is gone, it will go back to biting people.

[Copper]

If you believe in Snakk, take the opportunity to buy at under the SPP price.

Why worry about short term selling? It's just a dog licking its balls - after the itch is gone, it will go back to biting people.

Agree Balance.....I think the answer to your query as to why they used Sorensons services was answered the other day when I said they were lumped with him by default by accepting Claridge cum Regal Salmon cum CER ,s takeover/listing arrangement.As I said at the time,some unsavory groups do have good ideas at times.
Regards.....

[Balance]

Agree Balance.....I think the answer to your query as to why they used Sorensons services was answered the other day when I said they were lumped with him by default by accepting Claridge cum Regal Salmon cum CER ,s takeover/listing arrangement.As I said at the time,some unsavory groups do have good ideas at times.
Regards.....

There are others who can do backdoor listings.

[J R Ewing]

VIL (The Mad Butcher) is another backdoor listing. Twice the market cap of Snakk but none of the shenanigans, so much less interesting.