Nat/act/nzf 2023

[mistaTea]

You can hear her screeching like a dog on heat in the background. And watch her confronting and standing over Doocey.

And she has been a MP for 12 years and a minister! Something very wrong with her family life to behave like that.

https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/05/02/genter-outburst-deputy-speaker-had-never-seen-anything-like-it/

Hey not a big deal at all mate.

Daytr said she has apoligised, so that should be that! No need for further action or consequences because a bit of yelling and hooting in a fellow Parliamentarian's face is all part of good, robust debate!

JT says it is good to see her passion!

it is actually baffling how these guys can sit here day in, day out either out right defending... or playing things down... no matter what these people (Labour, Greens MP) do.

[iceman]

Trump card is a card hand phrase. Nothing to do with Donald.
Regards wheels are coming off, you are truly deluded,just like the woke media.

Did you expect something else from JT ? He just seems a bit more deluded and out of control, like Julie Anne Genter

[iceman]

Doe anyone have a link with audio?

The video in this link has audio

[ynot]

Did you expect something else from JT ? He just seems a bit more deluded and out of control, like Julie Anne Genter

I am just over hearing the woke left. They have trouble understanding the people have spoken and they are now history. Their days in power were an aberration, the likes of which we will fortunately not see again for some time.

[mistaTea]

I am just over hearing the woke left. They have trouble understanding the people have spoken and they are now history. Their days in power were an aberration, the likes of which we will fortunately not see again for some time.

You sure? According to Maiki a Labour-led government is imminent!

:D

[fungus pudding]

You sure? According to Maiki a Labour-led government is imminent!

:D

It's easy for the ruling party to lose support - but for the opposition party to lose support requires a special talent.

[causecelebre]

Not surprising MSM and the pearl clutching hand wringers and the squealing banshees of Maiki, and her cohorts, have reported nothing of the other April political polls going around at the moment, say Roy Morgan (66 seats vs 54) and The Tax Payers Union Curia poll (64, 56), still have the coalition ahead of "The Opposition"

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/nz-national-voting-intention-april-2024
https://www.taxpayers.org.nz/poll_april_2024

[mistaTea]

Well it has taken the entire day, but it looks like Chloe and Marama will (be forced to) front.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/julie-anne-genter-confrontation-green-party-co-leaders-chloe-swarbrick-and-marama-davidson-to-front-as-national-considers-complaint/3BWDQF5XHNF45DINRXYFRGI7NQ/

[Bjauck]

I am just over hearing the woke left. They have trouble understanding the people have spoken and they are now history. Their days in power were an aberration, the likes of which we will fortunately not see again for some time.
The NZ electorate has a short memory. The dozy right will need to keep on their toes.

[Joshuatree]

The NZ electorate has a short memory. The dozy right will need to keep on their toes.

What has this Govt done that's good for this country?

[Balance]

Wokeism and PC gone mad - $1.3m spent to rename Otago University te reo's name - at a time when the university is under financial stress.

Sooner the new government cut back funding for such nonsense, the better.

https://www.odt.co.nz/star-news/star-national/university-unveils-new-13m-branding

The name University of Otago remains, but the reo name has changed to Ōtākou Whakaihu Waka - a metaphor meaning A Place of Many Firsts.

[RTM]

Wokeism and PC gone mad - $1.3m spent to rename Otago University te reo's name - at a time when the university is under financial stress.

Sooner the new government cut back funding for such nonsense, the better.

https://www.odt.co.nz/star-news/star-national/university-unveils-new-13m-branding

The name University of Otago remains, but the reo name has changed to Ōtākou Whakaihu Waka - a metaphor meaning A Place of Many Firsts.

I also shake my head a bit with respect to them sponsoring the HIghlanders.

[Bjauck]

What has this Govt done that's good for this country?
I am giving them a bit more time to assess the impact of their actions. However we should keep your previous scorecard (that some posters did not like) to assess performance later.

I think we should join Aukus which Winnie is keen on.

[Bjauck]

Wokeism and PC gone mad - $1.3m spent to rename Otago University te reo's name - at a time when the university is under financial stress.

Sooner the new government cut back funding for such nonsense, the better.

https://www.odt.co.nz/star-news/star-national/university-unveils-new-13m-branding

The name University of Otago remains, but the reo name has changed to Ōtākou Whakaihu Waka - a metaphor meaning A Place of Many Firsts.
Nothing wrong with two names to reflect the official language. Do you object to any rebranding expense or just those that relate to adequately reflecting official languages?

[Bjauck]

You can hear her screeching like a dog on heat in the background. And watch her confronting and standing over Doocey.

And she has been a MP for 12 years and a minister! Something very wrong with her family life to behave like that.

https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/05/02/genter-outburst-deputy-speaker-had-never-seen-anything-like-it/

How did you describe male National Party MP Van De Molen’s behaviour? Was he a rutting stag?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/national-mp-tim-van-de-molen-found-in-contempt-of-house-of-parliament-for-threatening-behaviour-towards-labours-shanan-halbert/YREMSCEGM5C5ZP763YRCCO7LQY/#:~:text=National%20MP%20Tim%20van%20de%20Molen%20 has%20been%20stripped%20of,towards%20Labour%20MP%2 0Shanan%20Halbert.

[mistaTea]

How did you describe male National Party MP Van De Molen’s behaviour? Was he a rutting stag?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/national-mp-tim-van-de-molen-found-in-contempt-of-house-of-parliament-for-threatening-behaviour-towards-labours-shanan-halbert/YREMSCEGM5C5ZP763YRCCO7LQY/#:~:text=National%20MP%20Tim%20van%20de%20Molen%20 has%20been%20stripped%20of,towards%20Labour%20MP%2 0Shanan%20Halbert.

Not sure what the appropriate term is for this upstanding gentleman...

But maybe Genter will get the same punishment?

Oh sorry, I forgot - we aren't allowed to post Tui ads on here...

[jonu]

Nothing wrong with two names to reflect the official language. Do you object to any rebranding expense or just those that relate to adequately reflecting official languages?

How the hell do you justify spending 1.3 million doing it? I can guarantee if you were funding it out of your own pocket you would do it for under 10k and change signage when due to be replaced. Grant Robertson has found nirvana for the fiscally inept.

[Bjauck]

How the hell do you justify spending 1.3 million doing it? I can guarantee if you were funding it out of your own pocket you would do it for under 10k and change signage when due to be replaced. Grant Robertson has found nirvana for the fiscally inept.I wouldn’t rebrand anything. However the right branding and image is supposed to help with the appeal to your target market, so the fancy marketing people reckon…

[Balance]

How the hell do you justify spending 1.3 million doing it? I can guarantee if you were funding it out of your own pocket you would do it for under 10k and change signage when due to be replaced. Grant Robertson has found nirvana for the fiscally inept.

They must have planned well in advance for Grant Robertson?

New logo is of his HOLE?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/media/images/9Tzi8ywRz924XE3uHaD6DZ3Ef+IdbOiYlvIROR5vlqUeRrexTo cZGobKRJ9od%2Fgnk3B%2FCeKTmTAsIjj6Q0YaYXPpHcrgUUJl 78L+6jEUG+QthrqUJ9+bgzxfMuaKaP5SYh70iWIw0+IFTfpGr3 Df%2FHYNKEsoINXWY8XWNsmn8g4RioRuctaG7qwd4xW1c7RJt2 4VYQp3VS08ueB3NxWQSBJyVS45BSpLWwvieka%2FNWsGgoORzz uR%2F0fABgSa2ymSFyXlqKT6tArOqdO%2Fk6NQ2bjCl2rKFXzb w9sa8v0KZgwvclI3kbSu2KWfA8RCZ9kDoS%2FE+6AEwPrAubSy tiPGPRJ4WzvcT0F9WBsy%2FHT1XrZ3fW2QZDdI+xk%2FkAFiMI vErRP+1YvUSia+VPl5rSfq1Sptwv3wO%2FFOC4OIZjzqk9GNuM j3UqLq2rWLttz7InELNVDdIBoKYf7aq9YOQUID9A==?resolut ion=1240x700

[mistaTea]

Wow. Fresh allegations so soon.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/fresh-allegations-of-intimidation-emerge-against-green-mp-julie-anne-genter-wellington-florist-calls-her-a-bully/YXWHXJJGTJH4BIAGOX5CPVPJ74/

[Balance]

Wow. Fresh allegations so soon.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/fresh-allegations-of-intimidation-emerge-against-green-mp-julie-anne-genter-wellington-florist-calls-her-a-bully/YXWHXJJGTJH4BIAGOX5CPVPJ74/

Always the way.

On the fresh complaint, Green Party co-leader Chloe Swarbrick told the Herald the party’s leadership had not known about the incident with the florist prior to Thursday.

She said they had spoken to Genter about it and would not be disputing the story. It would be dealt with as part of the disciplinary process the Greens have begun.

[mistaTea]

Always the way.

On the fresh complaint, Green Party co-leader Chloe Swarbrick told the Herald the party’s leadership had not known about the incident with the florist prior to Thursday.

She said they had spoken to Genter about it and would not be disputing the story. It would be dealt with as part of the disciplinary process the Greens have begun.

I mean, who the Hell bullies a florist of all people!

[Balance]

I mean, who the Hell bullies a florist of all people!

Meanwhile, the investigation of Darleen Tana's exploitation of migrants (and alleged tax evasion) is stretching out to 7 weeks - from the initial 2 to 4 weeks that Davidson & Swarbrick stated.

And taxpayers continue to pay her salary & benefits while she is suspended and staying away from Parliament! Not a whisper from the MSM!

And we have the MSM jumping up and down righteously about the pay increases for Luxon and the ministers!

https://marcspring.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/unnamed.png

[mistaTea]

Meanwhile, the investigation of Darleen Tana's exploitation of migrants (and alleged tax evasion) is stretching out to 7 weeks - from the initial 2 to 4 weeks that Davidson & Swarbrick stated.

And taxpayers continue to pay her salary & benefits while she is suspended and staying away from Parliament!

https://marcspring.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/unnamed.png

They reckon it will go on for another full weeks…

All the while, full pay…

[Balance]

They reckon it will go on for another full weeks…

All the while, full pay…

Fxxk the system for a joke.

She should be made to pay back and reimburse whatever salary and benefits she received while suspended if she is forced to quit as a Green MP.

She is currently receiving $15,547 a month for doing nothing while the 'investigation' drags on and on.

[Daytr]

Always the way.

On the fresh complaint, Green Party co-leader Chloe Swarbrick told the Herald the party’s leadership had not known about the incident with the florist prior to Thursday.

She said they had spoken to Genter about it and would not be disputing the story. It would be dealt with as part of the disciplinary process the Greens have begun.

So the MSM media is quite not as biased as you make out.

[Balance]

So the MSM media is quite not as biased as you make out.

Forced to run the story - otherwise, like with Golriz they looked stupid when the story broke on social media and by 1ZM.

[Joshuatree]

So the MSM media is quite not as biased as you make out.
People on here are like the Klu Klux Klan hang em first as they may be a threat to what our triple treat threat Govt is doing ehh.
Blatant diversion to what this Cannibal Collective is doing to NZ,being hung drawn and quartered The Hyaenas are baying .

[mistaTea]

People on here are like the Klu Klux Klan hang em first as they may be a threat to what our triple treat threat Govt is doing ehh.
Blatant diversion to what this Cannibal Collective is doing to NZ,being hung drawn and quartered The Hyaenas are baying .

It is a fact that genter behaved inappropriately in parliament.

[Balance]

It is a fact that genter behaved inappropriately in parliament.

Don't mind her, mT - she is well known in these parts as having a few screws loose - too indoctrinated she has been by Clueless Cindy.

Suspect she has escaped from her asylum again - poor thing needs her medication.

[ynot]

Don't mind her, mT - she is well known in these parts as having a few screws loose - too indoctrinated she has been by Clueless Cindy.

Suspect she has escaped from her asylum again - poor thing needs her medication.

You could not make this stuff up as the saying goes. Extremism is probably the only way we are going to be rid this rot and the left are not disappointing on that front.

[Panda-NZ-]

Don't mind her, mT - she is well known in these parts as having a few screws loose - too indoctrinated she has been by Clueless Cindy.

Suspect she has escaped from her asylum again - poor thing needs her medication.

It's clear balance doesn't like women of any kind.

He pays special attention to women (see 1000+ posts on jacinda ardern).

[ynot]

It's clear balance doesn't like women of any kind.

He pays special attention to women (see 1000+ posts on jacinda ardern).

"Special attention" where special attention is due. Mad man, mad woman, if they are off their rocker they will be called out. Jacinda, Kiri, Golriz, Chloe, Julie Anne, .........etc. If the shoe fits ........

[blackcap]

"Special attention" where special attention is due. Mad man, mad woman, if they are off their rocker they will be called out. Jacinda, Kiri, Golriz, Chloe, Julie Anne, .........etc. If the shoe fits ........

You might as well just chuck in the whole Green party. Bunch of mad harpies right there. The lot of them.

[Daytr]

You mean it's reported on MSM?
Wow what do you know. That biased leftie media calling out one of their own.



You really are desperate to try make out this is comparable.
Well for the uneducated I will explain the seriousness of the Peters interview and not just this one, but let's start there.

Peters is the DPM & Foreign Minister.
What's Genter's position in opposition?

Peters was using aggressive tactics to try and avoid answering questions about his speech on AUKUS the night before that he clearly blundered. Again a very serious matter.

What was Genter involved in?

Apparently anything you don't like reading is hysterical. But I'm not the one making a beat up out a nothing heat of the moment event she has since apologized for.

I waste so much time on your BS, about time I pushed the button I think.

Winston Peters being served notice of defamation suit on behalf of Bob Carr.
Apparently this was nothing according to the Rightcysts on here.

Look over there, Genter waived a pamphlet in Peters face.

This is what you deem important, when our DPM is back tracking on what he has said in regards NZs most important foreign affairs reset in 30 - 40 years & Peters is making a meal of it. 🙄

Great look for NZ, our DPM & Foreign Minister completely out of his depth. He can't be this statesman at the UN & then revert to Trump like tactics at home. NZ isn't an echo chamber, as he has found out overnight.

https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/05/03/bob-carrs-lawyers-send-legal-letter-to-winston-peters/

[Daytr]

I am giving them a bit more time to assess the impact of their actions. However we should keep your previous scorecard (that some posters did not like) to assess performance later.

I think we should join Aukus which Winnie is keen on.

Be good to know what is in it before we join eh?

One of the main rumored sections is that NZ will committ to only buying US military tech & equipment, it may include the other parties or not. That means excluding purchases from the likes of Europe.

Also China is our largest trading partner & in the past we have been able to tow the diplomatic line. Look what happened to Australia's exports?
What if Trump or perhaps a aggressor Netanyahu type came to power in the US & we are tied to them at the hip.
It's not like the US haven't gone into foreign countries before just ply their will.

[mistaTea]

Winston Peters being served notice of defamation suit on behalf of Bob Carr.
Apparently this was nothing according to the Rightcysts on here.

Look over there, Genter waived a pamphlet in Peters face.

This is what you deem important, when our DPM is back tracking on what he has said in regards NZs most important foreign affairs reset in 30 - 40 years & Peters is making a meal of it. 🙄

Great look for NZ, our DPM & Foreign Minister completely out of his depth. He can't be this statesman at the UN & then revert to Trump like tactics at home. NZ isn't an echo chamber, as he has found out overnight.

https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/05/03/bob-carrs-lawyers-send-legal-letter-to-winston-peters/

You realise it is only defamation if what Winnie said is untrue yeah? The fact Bob has sent Winnie a letter at this stage means nothing.

We must wait and see if anything comes of this. If it goes to court and Winnie is found to have defamed him…that will be a serious matter indeed.

In the meantime, we have confirmed bad behaviour from Genter (I guess we we used to bad behaviour from the Greens now). And the original point being made was that you kick started yesterday with a strong rebuke of Winnie’s ALLEGED defamatory remarks… but were planning to stay quiet about Genter.

[Balance]

Winston called Carr a ‘Chinese puppet’ which is okay in the context of one politician criticising another. But to call someone who makes his living (post politics) as a promoter of Australian China trade a ‘puppet’ is serious defamation (if he is not) so I believe we will see this follow through in court. And let the court decide if that happens.

Genter is an entirely different matter indeed - guilty as sin because she did it in front of everyone in Parliament! And she made a non apology to try and get out of the bullying behaviour. And she has not turned up in Parliament to do her job but is on full pay!!! That’s Golriz, Tana and now Genter - suspended or MIA on full pay! WTF is going on?

[Panda-NZ-]

You realise it is only defamation if what Winnie said is untrue yeah? The fact Bob has sent Winnie a letter at this stage means nothing.

We must wait and see if anything comes of this. If it goes to court and Winnie is found to have defamed him…that will be a serious matter indeed.

In the meantime, we have confirmed bad behaviour from Genter (I guess we we used to bad behaviour from the Greens now). And the original point being made was that you kick started yesterday with a strong rebuke of Winnie’s ALLEGED defamatory remarks… but were planning to stay quiet about Genter.

Imagine an American diplomat coming here and calling a former NZ PM or senior minister the things winston has said.

All for a few cheap points on a sean plunket youtube video /podcast, ie the peanut gallery.

[Joshuatree]

It is a fact that genter behaved inappropriately in parliament.
It's being used to cover over the cracks.This Cannibal Collective Govt from Hell is not delivering it's tearing down things,vindictively, kicking over a sandcastle but contributing little for this Country.Backwardation in action.

[Daytr]

You realise it is only defamation if what Winnie said is untrue yeah? The fact Bob has sent Winnie a letter at this stage means nothing.

We must wait and see if anything comes of this. If it goes to court and Winnie is found to have defamed him…that will be a serious matter indeed.

In the meantime, we have confirmed bad behaviour from Genter (I guess we we used to bad behaviour from the Greens now). And the original point being made was that you kick started yesterday with a strong rebuke of Winnie’s ALLEGED defamatory remarks… but were planning to stay quiet about Genter.

Oh for gawd's sake.
Where did I say it was confirmed defamation?
Seriously, your reading skills certainly aren't improving.

The defamation suit is only one part of it. What is probably more serious is Peter's speech on AUKUS that he is having to back track on & the reason why he went on the attack in the RNZ interview and lost the plot by accusing Bob Carr of being on China's payroll.

I really don't care about Genter. She is inconsequential. This is also not the Green's thread.

The DPM & Foreign Minister botching a speech on a potential major military alliance & then accusing a respected Australian political figure of basically being corrupt, is very serious.
Luxon must be trying to find hair to pullout.

You say you're not here to defend Peters.
Wow if it smells like BS, it probably is BS.

Rightly so the Peter's international issue is heading the news. Plenty of coverage of Genter for the Muppets who are easily distracted as well. What a balanced media we have.

Coverage for the politically engaged and those who are more into soap operas.

[Balance]

Plenty of coverage of Genter for the Muppets who are easily distracted as well. What a balanced media we have.

Coverage for the politically engaged and those who are more into soap operas.

One rule for females and one rule for males when it comes to unacceptable bullying and threatening behaviour.

Precisely the sort of garbage response and excuse to be expected from the woke leftists like Daytr.

Exactly the same BS which allowed Clueless Cindy to behaved as she did - lying to NZers and doing a runner when she was found out.

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/kerre-woodham-mornings/opinion/kerre-woodham-julie-anne-genter-deserves-all-the-censure-parliament-can-throw-at-her/

I cannot believe already there have been texts this morning saying, oh, come on, it’s fake news, you know. Bigger things to worry about. I don't think so. What is it about Transport Committee hearings that excites so much passion? Because that's what happened with Van de Molen and Halbert. And the last one, it was a transport committee. And here we had Simeon Brown answering questions from the floor.

I don't know how much the Debbie Francis review into bullying in Parliament cost, but it doesn't seem to have improved matters much, does it? Julie Anne Genter deserves all the censure Parliament can throw at her, as would any MP of any hue who behaved in that fashion?

[Daytr]

Winston called Carr a ‘Chinese puppet’ which is okay in the context of one politician criticising another. But to call someone who makes his living (post politics) as a promoter of Australian China trade a ‘puppet’ is serious defamation (if he is not) so I believe we will see this follow through in court. And let the court decide if that happens.

Genter is an entirely different matter indeed - guilty as sin because she did it in front of everyone in Parliament! And she made a non apology to try and get out of the bullying behaviour. And she has not turned up in Parliament to do her job but is on full pay!!! That’s Golriz, Tana and now Genter - suspended or MIA on full pay! WTF is going on?

Nope Peters said something along the lines of that Carr was on the Chinese Payroll as well as being a Chinese puppet.
That is what Carr is claiming defamation on.

This part has been removed from the interview due to the claim of defamation. I heard it live, but when I just played it back it was missing.
But then I saw that section has been removed for legal reasons.

See below.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/515826/winston-peters-receives-legal-letter-from-bob-carr-after-defamation-threat

[ynot]

Imagine an American diplomat coming here and calling a former NZ PM or senior minister the things winston has said.

All for a few cheap points on a sean plunket youtube video /podcast, ie the peanut gallery.


You want peanut gallery, What about the constant nightly left bias on tvnz news. 24/7 BS. Fortunately their days are numbered.

[Balance]

Nope Peters said something along the lines of that Carr was on the Chinese Payroll as well as being a Chinese puppet.
That is what Carr is claiming defamation on.

This part has been removed from the interview due to the claim of defamation. I heard it live, but when I just played it back it was missing.
But then I saw that section has been removed for legal reasons.

See below.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/515826/winston-peters-receives-legal-letter-from-bob-carr-after-defamation-threat

Fair enough and as I have already posted, let the courts decide if the case goes ahead.

[Daytr]

Fair enough and as I have already posted, let the courts decide if the case goes ahead.

Well I'm sure they will and a huge amount of negative publicity for NZ will follow being it our DPM & Foreign Minister the one litigated against. This could see Peter's forced to resign as Foreign Minister at least.

Unless of course Peter's succeeds in doing the smart thing and issues a public apology and manages to convince Carr of dropping the suit.

But Carr is a man of principle and was a very good NSW Premiere, he was in power when I lived there. So he may just decide he wants his day in court.

But according to some on here, the Genter issue is a much bigger thing. 🤣🤣🤣
How do they post such a ridiculous comparison and be taken seriously?
Well I know why, but I don't want to add insult to those who are already clearly challenged.

[mistaTea]

Well I'm sure they will and a huge amount of negative publicity for NZ will follow being it our DPM & Foreign Minister the one litigated against. This could see Peter's forced to resign as Foreign Minister at least.

Unless of course Peter's succeeds in doing the smart thing and issues a public apology and manages to convince Carr of dropping the suit.

But Carr is a man of principle and was a very good NSW Premiere, he was in power when I lived there. So he may just decide he wants his day in court.

But according to some on here, the Genter issue is a much bigger thing. 藍藍藍
How do they post such a ridiculous comparison and be taken seriously?
Well I know why, but I don't want to add insult to those who are already clearly challenged.

You can insult as many people as you like, you have still not said anything to indicates you are not biased.

If Winnie has defamed Bob, then I hope Bob goes all the way. There will be serious consequences for Winnie if it goes all the way the the court finds for Bob.

I know that you think an allegation of defamation is worse than a MP crossing the floor and abusing a fellow Parlimentarian. But I do not share that opinion.

[mistaTea]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/media-insider-tvnz-political-editor-maiki-sherman-speaks-on-poll-coverage-tvnz-and-nzfc-chair-alastair-carruthers-in-spotlight-rupert-murdochs-nz-move/4XZGDIR5WNCMLAWMESQW6RZBNQ/

Maiki on her hysterical performance over 'that poll'.


“It’s been a big and interesting week,” Sherman told Media Insider from the Parliamentary press gallery yesterday.She was aware there had been a lot of feedback but had not been able to fully engage with it all because of a hectic workload.
“Every day has been super busy and I’ve been dealing with a lot of things other than that issue which, honestly, I didn’t quite understand. I appreciate the feedback but I was surprised at the level of enthusiasm and criticism that people had towards the way that I presented the poll.”
Sherman says she is always listening to her viewers.

“Because I care so deeply about doing a good job and taking the entire audience along with me and securing their trust, I am always open to feedback.
“I’ll be open to tweaking the way that I may present a poll, but not completely. I don’t want to lose my own style and my own flair and what I bring to this role.
“While I’ll take feedback on, genuinely, I’ll be the decider of where it lands at the end of the day.”

You see, I just want 'the news'... not for Maiki or anyone to take me along with her.

And, if she keeps up this sensationalist and biased reporting... she will not be the decider of where anything lands. Lose enough eyeballs, and she will be told to tone it down.

[Daytr]

You can insult as many people as you like, you have still not said anything to indicates you are not biased.

If Winnie has defamed Bob, then I hope Bob goes all the way. There will be serious consequences for Winnie if it goes all the way the the court finds for Bob.

I know that you think an allegation of defamation is worse than a MP crossing the floor and abusing a fellow Parlimentarian. But I do not share that opinion.

Biased about what?
Me not caring about what Genter did, for anyone with blinkers off, may indicate I don't consider her important enough to make a big issue of.
As I said I just don't care.

Issue of the day by local yokels.
Woman waves booklet in man's face!
Ohhhh, shock horror.

Each to their own opinion of course not matter how ridiculous.
But please by all means keep doubling down on your idiocy.

DPM & Foreign Minister fluffs lines on the biggest Foreign Policy reset in 40 years & insults high profile Australian ex Foreign Minister at the same time.
I wonder how much coverage of Genter is covered overseas? 🤣🤣🤣

Fish in a barrel I tell ya.

[mistaTea]

Biased about what?
Me not caring about what Genter did, for anyone with blinkers off, may indicate I don't consider her important enough to make a big issue of.
As I said I just don't care.



Yes, we get it. You only care about negative news when it is applicable to the current government.

[Daytr]

Yes, we get it. You only care about negative news when it is applicable to the current government.

If your imagination makes you feel happy then so be it. Stay in your alternate reality buddy.
I've vote right more than I have voted left.
I certainly didn't vote for Labour or the Greens in the last election.

But keep think you know me or what I think. That's your ego talking. A desperate ego.

See ya buddy. I've promised long enough.
Just too much time wasted on a barrage of fiction & BS. At least Balance in between his continual insults & bias, is actually quite knowledgeable and obviously has some good contacts & at time he surprises me.
Call it a few polished gems on a beach of sharp pebbles. Your beach is more like a mud flat.

[Ferg]

Some history for interested readers about Bob Carr:
https://thebfd.co.nz/2024/05/03/wily-winston-far-too-clever-for-bob-carr-and-david-parker/

[mistaTea]

I've vote right more than I have voted right.


He he. Ok mate.

[Bjauck]

Well I'm sure they will and a huge amount of negative publicity for NZ will follow being it our DPM & Foreign Minister the one litigated against. This could see Peter's forced to resign as Foreign Minister at least.

Unless of course Peter's succeeds in doing the smart thing and issues a public apology and manages to convince Carr of dropping the suit.

But Carr is a man of principle and was a very good NSW Premiere, he was in power when I lived there. So he may just decide he wants his day in court.

But according to some on here, the Genter issue is a much bigger thing. 藍藍藍
How do they post such a ridiculous comparison and be taken seriously?
Well I know why, but I don't want to add insult to those who are already clearly challenged.
The Foreign Minister needs to be diplomatic, even with leftie foreigners. They can affect important international relations. Peters is not an obvious choice for diplomacy but National had to give Peters the bauble of high office to get a coalition across the line. So Luxon now has to devote time to wrangling his coalition partner.

[Daytr]

The Foreign Minister needs to be diplomatic, even with leftie foreigners. They can affect important international relations. Peters is not an obvious choice for diplomacy but National had to give Peters the bauble of high office to get a coalition across the line. So Luxon now has to devote time to wrangling his coalition partner.

The problem with Peter's is he thinks he can be this statesman overseas, which I think he has done relatively well at the UN etc, (but according to some I'm biased) and then he behaves like a bully, be incoherent and spray insults and allegations at home & it won't come back to bite him, but even worse bite NZ which he is representing.

Doh! It's a big wide world out there and he's been found out.

[mistaTea]

The problem with Peter's is he thinks he can be this statesman overseas, which I think he has done relatively well at the UN etc, (but according to some I'm biased) and then he behaves like a bully, be incoherent and spray insults and allegations at home & it won't come back to bite him, but even worse bite NZ which he is representing.

Doh! It's a big wide world out there and he's been found out.

Saying one concilliatory statement about Winnie is not evidence of your impartiality.

[Daytr]

Some history for interested readers about Bob Carr:
https://thebfd.co.nz/2024/05/03/wily-winston-far-too-clever-for-bob-carr-and-david-parker/

The BFD sighting reports from the Murdoch owned The Australian.
Right wing bias, reporting on right wing bias.
How anyone can take the BFD seriously after what Whale Oil was exposed for is beyond me.

Let's see how clever he is if it goes to court.

[Bjauck]

The problem with Peter's is he thinks he can be this statesman overseas, which I think he has done relatively well at the UN etc, (but according to some I'm biased) and then he behaves like a bully, be incoherent and spray insults and allegations at home & it won't come back to bite him, but even worse bite NZ which he is representing.

Doh! It's a big wide world out there and he's been found out.
I actually agree with the foreign affairs policies that Peters canvassed at the Instsitute of International Affairs. I hope he does stay in office and remain at least passably diplomatic.

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/speech-new-zealand-institute-international-affairs-parliament-–-annual-lecture-challenges

[Daytr]

Saying one concilliatory statement about Winnie is not evidence of your impartiality.

Need to get to my laptop to switch you off but that will be after lunch.

How many interactions have you personally had with Winston Peter's or Shane Jones?
I ran a social media campaign for Peter's to get him elected in 2015. Even then I had frank discussions with him about his at the time xenophobic remarks & how I could only support him if he toned that down.

Shane Jones I have had a similar minor relationship with. At odds one minute but agree on other things. Some of the funding he supplied through the PGF was excellent, some was ill advised, some seemed a bit slippery for my liking and some certainly didn't meet the criteria that the Fund or the Covid Response set out.

Anyway, I better be careful as I want a fair chunk of change from him for my next charitable venture.

Relationships are nuanced, well for the educated they are. One thing doesn't necessarily mean another & the world certainly isn't black & white.
I know you will struggle with that concept, but just breathe buddy, before you keep shooting from the hip.

[blackcap]

Seems to me that Bob Carr is a Chinese puppet. Winston may well be right.

[mistaTea]

Need to get to my laptop to switch you off but that will be after lunch.

How many interactions have you personally had with Winston Peter's or Shane Jones?
I ran a social media campaign for Peter's to get him elected in 2015. Even then I had frank discussions with him about his at the time xenophobic remarks & how I could only support him if he toned that down.

Shane Jones I have had a similar minor relationship with. At odds one minute but agree on other things. Some of the funding he supplied through the PGF was excellent, some was ill advised, some seemed a bit slippery for my liking and some certainly didn't meet the criteria that the Fund or the Covid Response set out.

Anyway, I better be careful as I want a fair chunk of change from him for my next charitable venture.

Relationships are nuanced, well for the educated they are. One thing doesn't necessarily mean another & the world certainly isn't black & white.
I know you will struggle with that concept, but just breathe buddy, before you keep shooting from the hip.

Nobody believes your supercilious bs mate.

Now just hush for the live of God.

[Panda-NZ-]

Seems to me that Bob Carr is a Chinese puppet. Winston may well be right.

Why? for having an opinion. Try andrew robb if you want to go down that road (where actions were taken vs words).

[Panda-NZ-]

Excerpts from Bobb Carr's letter to our esteemed foreign minister.



We place you on notice that we are now in the process of instructing New Zealand lawyers to advise in relation to the immediate commencement in New Zealand of defamation proceedings against you," the letter read. "…The Statements are indefensibly defamatory of our client and have no basis in fact. In that regard, our client has never had any business relationship with any Chinese entity, nor has he ever served on the Board of any Chinese company. "Further, he has never acted as an adviser or consultant to any Chinese company, nor has he ever been in receipt of any income from any Chinese shareholding or investment consultancy."

Seems fair enough.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2024/05/winston-peters-hits-back-at-former-australian-politician-bob-carr-s-legal-threat-as-irrelevant-ill-informed-shill.html

[Daytr]

Nobody believes your supercilious bs mate.

Now just hush for the live of God.

🤣🤣🤣🤣
Seriously that's the best response you can come up with? Some people have the benefit of enough wisdom to know when to give up and keep their mouths shut.
Others....

I'm sure everyone is as bored as I am with this ridiculous tit for tat. So I'm on my lap top now buddy so see ya.

No doubt you will keep trying to bait & engage like you have until now. But that's just because like the great song Zombie goes.
I'm in your head, in your head...
Well let's face it, there's plenty of room in there.

[Ferg]

Excerpts from Bobb Carr's letter to our esteemed foreign minister.

[snip]

our client has never had any business relationship with any Chinese entity, nor has he ever served on the Board of any Chinese company. "Further, he has never acted as an adviser or consultant to any Chinese company, nor has he ever been in receipt of any income from any Chinese shareholding or investment consultancy.


Those are highly specific refutations and not necessarily all-encompassing. It doesn't mention employment relationships, nor does it define 'Chinese company' (what is a Chinese company?) and the refutation regarding receipts only include those from shareholdings and investment consultancy. That excludes business consultancy, political consultancy and many other forms of consultancy - not forgetting there are many other forms of remuneration. It would be better to have a wide ranging and all encompassing refutation rather than one that is highly specific and narrowly defined.

So far this sounds like dogs barking at each other. Interesting that Carr never sued the AFR for similar statements - I wonder why...?

Aren't we missing the bigger point - why is some formerly employed foreigner coming here and telling Kiwis what we can and can't do (or should or should not do) with our foreign policy? He can piss right off to where he came from. He's not part of any Government delegation that I'm aware of so for others to think this is some sort of massive international incident should stick to watching James Shaw videos.

[ynot]

Those are highly specific refutations and not necessarily all-encompassing. It doesn't mention employment relationships, nor does it define 'Chinese company' (what is a Chinese company?) and the refutation regarding receipts only include those from shareholdings and investment consultancy. That excludes business consultancy, political consultancy and many other forms of consultancy - not forgetting there are many other forms of remuneration. It would be better to have a wide ranging and all encompassing refutation rather than one that is highly specific and narrowly defined.

So far this sounds like dogs barking at each other. Interesting that Carr never sued the AFR for similar statements - I wonder why...?

Aren't we missing the bigger point - why is some formerly employed foreigner coming here and telling Kiwis what we can and can't do (or should or should not do) with our foreign policy? He can piss right off to where he came from. He's not part of any Government delegation that I'm aware of so for others to think this is some sort of massive international incident should stick to watching James Shaw videos.

Agree. He is just another has been politician like Helen Clark that think they have a god given right to continue to wield political clout well after their best by date.

[Daytr]

Those are highly specific refutations and not necessarily all-encompassing. It doesn't mention employment relationships, nor does it define 'Chinese company' (what is a Chinese company?) and the refutation regarding receipts only include those from shareholdings and investment consultancy. That excludes business consultancy, political consultancy and many other forms of consultancy - not forgetting there are many other forms of remuneration. It would be better to have a wide ranging and all encompassing refutation rather than one that is highly specific and narrowly defined.

So far this sounds like dogs barking at each other. Interesting that Carr never sued the AFR for similar statements - I wonder why...?

Aren't we missing the bigger point - why is some formerly employed foreigner coming here and telling Kiwis what we can and can't do (or should or should not do) with our foreign policy? He can piss right off to where he came from. He's not part of any Government delegation that I'm aware of so for others to think this is some sort of massive international incident should stick to watching James Shaw videos.

Well it's more interesting that it appears Carr is prepared to go to court over what Peters said. So perhaps what Peters said over stepped what the AFR reported.
We will find out.

Carr was asked his opinion of AUKUS and he gave it. Nothing wrong in that even if you don't agree with his opinion. He isn't representing Australia, unlike Peters and Carr has knowledge of the subject.

Apparently Peters doesn't, or that's what he is telling us.

[mistaTea]

Those are highly specific refutations and not necessarily all-encompassing. It doesn't mention employment relationships, nor does it define 'Chinese company' (what is a Chinese company?) and the refutation regarding receipts only include those from shareholdings and investment consultancy. That excludes business consultancy, political consultancy and many other forms of consultancy - not forgetting there are many other forms of remuneration. It would be better to have a wide ranging and all encompassing refutation rather than one that is highly specific and narrowly defined.

So far this sounds like dogs barking at each other. Interesting that Carr never sued the AFR for similar statements - I wonder why...?

Aren't we missing the bigger point - why is some formerly employed foreigner coming here and telling Kiwis what we can and can't do (or should or should not do) with our foreign policy? He can piss right off to where he came from. He's not part of any Government delegation that I'm aware of so for others to think this is some sort of massive international incident should stick to watching James Shaw videos.

Yeah and very easy to say someone has ‘defamed’ you.

Let’s see if it goes anywhere and is tested in court.

The hurdle for ‘defamation’ should be high.

[Balance]

More revelations about Hysterical Hipkins leaving yet more mess for the new government to sort out.

This time, Hipkins as Minister of Education hid a 300% cost blowout to over $400m for the integration of 2 schools (Project Te Tātoru o Wairau - WTF it meant) which he decided to go ahead.

Project was scrapped after $25m was spent on consultancy & design work. Just add it to the $228m light rail cost etc etc.

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2024/05/how_hipkins_hid_the_400_million_school_move_blowou t.html

https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350246034/how-did-cost-moving-two-schools-blow-out-more-400m

[Daytr]

More revelations about Hysterical Hipkins leaving yet more mess for the new government to sort out.

This time, Hipkins as Minister of Education hid a 300% cost blowout to over $400m for the integration of 2 schools (Project Te Tātoru o Wairau - WTF it meant) which he decided to go ahead.

Project was scrapped after $25m was spent on consultancy & design work. Just add it to the $228m light rail cost etc etc.

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2024/05/how_hipkins_hid_the_400_million_school_move_blowou t.html

https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350246034/how-did-cost-moving-two-schools-blow-out-more-400m

Again wrong thread.
But yep what an absolute unmitigated disaster.

[777]

Again wrong thread.
But yep what an absolute unmitigated disaster.

Why is it the wrong thread? It is just another thing for the coalition to fix.

[Bjauck]

Imagine an American diplomat coming here and calling a former NZ PM or senior minister the things winston has said.

All for a few cheap points on a sean plunket youtube video /podcast, ie the peanut gallery. Mind you, Bob Carr has criticised that Winston Peters was trying to roll back NZ’s nuclear free policy. Why did he get himself involved in NZ politics?

Former Oz Labor PM Keating has criticised Aukus too. He has a good relationship with China and criticises Oz media coverage of China. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/mar/18/paul-keating-says-the-australian-should-be-contemptuously-ignored-ahead-of-wang-yi-meeting

Let’s not forget that our own former National Party PM Sir John Key wants a conciliatory approach to China.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/former-pm-sir-john-key-defends-chinas-chequebook-diplomacy/JO7DDC5OB5R2T3NW2OQT73ULEE/

[Daytr]

Why is it the wrong thread? It is just another thing for the coalition to fix.

So shall we put all NAFTS stuff ups in the Labour page? 🙄

[Daytr]

Mind you, Bob Carr has criticised that Winston Peters was trying to roll back NZ’s nuclear free policy. Why did he get himself involved in NZ politics?

Former Oz Labor PM Keating has criticised Aukus too. He has a good relationship with China and criticises Oz media coverage of China. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/mar/18/paul-keating-says-the-australian-should-be-contemptuously-ignored-ahead-of-wang-yi-meeting

Let’s not forget that our own former National Party PM Sir John Key wants a conciliatory approach to China.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/former-pm-sir-john-key-defends-chinas-chequebook-diplomacy/JO7DDC5OB5R2T3NW2OQT73ULEE/

So it's OK for Australia's billionaires, Gina Rhinehart etc to have a good relationship with the Chinese but not politicians?
Shouldn't you have good relationships with your biggest trading partner?

That doesn't mean you have to cosy up to them & not speak diplomatically about what you disagree with.

Morrison's Government has cost the Australian economy $100s of billions and over time it could be more as China divest itself off its dependence on Australian minerals.

The US are in a difficult position. There status as the premier world power is under threat, as not only China's influence increases but so to will Russian backed India.

AUKUS one is about nuclear submarines, again Carr was asked his opinion & he gave it, he's not representing Australia & he has prior knowledge of the matter.
That's no reason for Peter's to lose the plot.

[Balance]

Another mess for the new government to clean up - Oranga Tamariki.

Staff numbers increased from 3370 in 2017 to 4651 last year - 38% more staff and what did they achieve?

Fxxk all is the answer as the following example illustrates :

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/hundreds-of-auckland-young-offenders-escaping-custody-and-the-document-oranga-tamariki-didnt-want-you-to-see/KDCOC65ATBAMVMFAKEVJYAU4VQ/

Hundreds of Auckland young offenders escaping custody — and the document Oranga Tamariki didn’t want you to see

[Balance]

Some great news!

Best money ever to be spent on education - so little to be spent with the potential to achieve so much.

Can never understand myself why schools in NZ moved away from teaching reading using phonics - we actually sent our kids to phonic classes at our own expense and what a huge positive difference it made to their reading habits and academic achievements vs their peers.

Yet another example of kids becoming social and educational experiments by the Ministry of Education - to their detriment.

$67m to introduce and roll out Structured Literacy in all NZ schools.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/education/education-minister-erica-standford-can-retire-happy-if-structured-learning-takes-off-in-nz-schools-the-front-page/DXZY6YZPORAQTO23TXWXCVFRZQ/

"The project has a $67 million price tag, which will pay for books and resources for teachers, support development for teachers and the introduction of phonics as well as additional support for students that require it.

She told The Front Page that in the past 20 or 30 years, we had seen literacy rates dropping and that could be traced back to the fact we had been teaching kids the habits of poor readers."

[777]

So shall we put all NAFTS stuff ups in the Labour page? ��

Yes if (doubt) they get back into power go for it.

[Daytr]

Yes if (doubt) they get back into power go for it.

OK I'll be good and do as you say. 🙄
Rather than respect what a thread is about.
Just litter it with any old thing.

Buddy NZ has a history of swinging back & fourth. The Nats were in complete disarray for a number of years after they lost power.

It will be good for all of us to have a strong opposition, whether they secure power or not.
National also need the support of two minor parties.
The bigger question is can the menage a trios last?

[Balance]

OK I'll be good and do as you say. ��
Rather than respect what a thread is about.
Just litter it with any old thing.

Buddy NZ has a history of swinging back & fourth. The Nats were in complete disarray for a number of years after they lost power.

It will be good for all of us to have a strong opposition, whether they secure power or not.
National also need the support of two minor parties.
The bigger question is can the menage a trios last?

Bye bye Daytr.

Celebration time for us on this thread!

Now, kindly pxss off to post in your cherished Labour thread.

[Daytr]

Bye bye Daytr.

Celebration time for us on this thread!

Now, kindly pxss off to post in your cherished Labour thread.

Oh Balance, always thinking you have more influence than you do, like some big swinging dick. 🤣

Buddy you couldn't influence yourself out of ur own lunchbox.

What I find very interesting, is very few of the Rightcysts on here want to have an honest conversation or actually here both sides. Many want only to have a right-wing media. They want an echo chamber of their right-wing ideology.
Pretty similar to how the Nazis party started out.
Threatening or insulting anyone that thought differently to them.

There's only one way, our way and all that BS.
It's actually a very dangerous ideology and should be stomped out and called out for what it is.

[Balance]

Oh Balance, always thinking you have more influence than you do, like some big swinging dick. ��

Buddy you couldn't influence yourself out of ur own lunchbox.

What I find very interesting, is very few of the Rightcysts on here want to have an honest conversation or actually here both sides. Many want only to have a right-wing media. They want an echo chamber of their right-wing ideology.
Pretty similar to how the Nazis party started out.
Threatening or insulting anyone that thought differently to the.

There's only one way, our way and all that BS.
It's actually a very dangerous ideology and should be stomped out and called out for what it is.

Why are you still posting here?

[ynot]

Oh Balance, always thinking you have more influence than you do, like some big swinging dick. 🤣

Buddy you couldn't influence yourself out of ur own lunchbox.

What I find very interesting, is very few of the Rightcysts on here want to have an honest conversation or actually here both sides. Many want only to have a right-wing media. They want an echo chamber of their right-wing ideology.
Pretty similar to how the Nazis party started out.
Threatening or insulting anyone that thought differently to the.

There's only one way, our way and all that BS.
It's actually a very dangerous ideology and should be stomped out and called out for what it is.

Nazi behavior belongs fair and square with your mob. No chance your going to convince anyone here otherwise. Like I said Daytr, you are full of it.

[Daytr]

Why are you still posting here?

Who do you think you are?
Bullying might have worked for you at school buddy but it's time to put your big boy pants on & stop the crude & childish behaviour.

[Daytr]

Nazi behavior belongs fair and square with your mob. No chance your going to convince anyone here otherwise. Like I said Daytr, you are full of it.

Confusing your left & your right?

Not sure what you mean by my mob?
You mean the parties I didn't vote for?

I never saw Labour trying to shut down the right wing media.

[Balance]

Who do you think you are?
Bullying might have worked for you at school buddy but it's time to put your big boy pants on & stop the crude & childish behaviour.

Simply reminding you of your wish to post on the Labour thread - your wish, nothing to do with bullying which you woke leftists do so well.

Kiri Allan, Ginny Andersen, Genter …

[Bjauck]

So it's OK for Australia's billionaires, Gina Rhinehart etc to have a good relationship with the Chinese but not politicians?
Shouldn't you have good relationships with your biggest trading partner?

That doesn't mean you have to cosy up to them & not speak diplomatically about what you disagree with.

Morrison's Government has cost the Australian economy $100s of billions and over time it could be more as China divest itself off its dependence on Australian minerals.

The US are in a difficult position. There status as the premier world power is under threat, as not only China's influence increases but so to will Russian backed India.

AUKUS one is about nuclear submarines, again Carr was asked his opinion & he gave it, he's not representing Australia & he has prior knowledge of the matter.
That's no reason for Peter's to lose the plot.Aukus though is developing into more than just nuclear subs. Back when we had a heavily dependent economic relationship with Britain, fortunately most people in NZ were keen members of the British Empire and Commonwealth. It will be interesting to see how the relationship develops with Communist China.

[mistaTea]

Simply reminding you of your wish to post on the Labour thread - your wish, nothing to do with bullying which you woke leftists do so well.

Kiri Allan, Ginny Andersen, Genter …


Just love how Daytr pulls out the bully card when so many of his posts are full of personal attacks when he doesn't like people calling him out on his bs.

[Daytr]

Aukus though is developing into more than just nuclear subs. Back when we had a heavily dependent economic relationship with Britain, fortunately most people in NZ were keen members of the British Empire and Commonwealth. It will be interesting to see how the relationship develops with Communist China.

Sure but into what? No one seems willing to say.
One of things suggested is, if NZ joined it would only be able to buy US military technology and arms. Proof will be in the pudding but Luxon was non-committal about any disclosure.

We have what I would term a pretty balanced relationship with China to date. In this part of the world we have to be nimble and adapt to all different regimes. Communist Vietnam is one of the fasted growing economies in the world.
Indonesia will have more influence over time.
Best we get on with our Pacific neighbours as much as necessary.

[Ferg]

What I find very interesting, is very few of the Rightcysts on here want to have an honest conversation or actually here both sides. Many want only to have a right-wing media. They want an echo chamber of their right-wing ideology.
Pretty similar to how the Nazis party started out.

Now it's time for me to say that you are missing the point. It is interesting you say you want a debate. As previously pointed out, you use a plethora of fallacies in your arguments. IOW you are not able to practice what you preach to, or demand of, others. You aren't being taken seriously hence the reason no-one engages seriously with you. Someone recently tried to have a rational debate with you and you immediately played the race card. That is appalling behaviour.

Furthermore, you cannot accurately state your opponents position and you are putting up strawman arguments. Not a single poster here has said they want a right wing media. People want a balanced media. And no one here has said they want an echo chamber. So you shouldn't be surprised if no one is going to argue against your pre-defined and incorrect strawman propositions.

Lastly, your factual inaccuracies have been pointed out by others with links to sources but you never acknowledge them. Instead you would rather work yourself into a lather as you try to 'win' an online argument with strangers.

And now you invoke Godwin's law....it didn't even take 2 posts to get there.....just the one. This makes your posts a joke. They cannot be taken seriously hence the numerous less than serious replies from numerous posters to your posts. You must be incredibly bored or missing something in your life to continue engaging in such an argumentative manner. For your own sake take some time out and get some fresh air.

[Daytr]

Now it's time for me to say that you are missing the point. It is interesting you say you want a debate. As previously pointed out, you use a plethora of fallacies in your arguments. IOW you are not able to practice what you preach to, or demand of, others. You aren't being taken seriously hence the reason no-one engages seriously with you. Someone recently tried to have a rational debate with you and you immediately played the race card. That is appalling behaviour.

Furthermore, you cannot accurately state your opponents position and you are putting up strawman arguments. Not a single poster here has said they want a right wing media. People want a balanced media. And no one here has said they want an echo chamber. So you shouldn't be surprised if no one is going to argue against your pre-defined and incorrect strawman propositions.

Lastly, your factual inaccuracies have been pointed out by others with links to sources but you never acknowledge them. Instead you would rather work yourself into a lather as you try to 'win' an online argument with strangers.

And now you invoke Godwin's law....it didn't even take 2 posts to get there.....just the one. This makes your posts a joke. They cannot be taken seriously hence the numerous less than serious replies from numerous posters to your posts. You must be incredibly bored or missing something in your life to continue engaging in such an argumentative manner. For your own sake take some time out and get some fresh air.

Ferg, on several occasions on these threads I
have seen posts from various participants stating they hope the left leaning MSM falls over or disappears etc.
Referencing Stuff, NZH, News Hub etc I.e mainstream media.

I'm not sure how you could miss these posts?
Please provide examples of the factual inaccuracies you claim.
Fallacies? Anything?
I didn't play the race card. The conditions were relating to Maori it was a fair question.
There has always been conditions, but now the conditions are a problem.

There is a constant barrage of insults, complete exaggerations and denials from many repetitive rabid right wing posters on here, but no mention of them huh?

Open the other one Ferg. Most of the posts I have seen from you replying to me are full of bluster without substance.
Par for the course.

And the one poster who did recently engage with I made comment as such re the respect shown, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with them.

Bjauck is another respectful poster on here and it's good to engage with people like that.

So where is your outrage at all the insults, quite ugly remarks and derision that the likes of Balance and others continually hurl?

Didn't think so.
Rightcysts echo chamber.
Don't think so buddy.

If you don't like reading my posts, you know what to do. Like I have with MistaTea recently.

[Ferg]

Wanting a left leaning media to fail is not the same as wanting only a right wing media per your post. If you fail to understand this then your blinkers are showing: your one-eyed bias was called out recently here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050094&viewfull=1#post1050094) and here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050106&viewfull=1#post1050106).

Pointing out factual inaccuracies that were not addressed: recent examples here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050081&viewfull=1#post1050081) and here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050269&viewfull=1#post1050269).

Playing the race card: here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050075&viewfull=1#post1050075) which I will quote so everyone can see it.

But to complain issues & news pertaining to Maori is getting coverage says only one thing about the complainant
That is appalling to play the race card given TGB was not talking about Maori getting coverage.

If you want to play the "whataboutism" game then I suggest you remove the beam from your own eye before removing the speck from mine. No mention from you about the appalling posts from your leftie mates. Hypocrite.

I find your posts entertaining - but not for the reasons you think.

Get some fresh air. It will do you wonders.

[ynot]

Wanting a left leaning media to fail is not the same as wanting only a right wing media per your post. If you fail to understand this then your blinkers are showing: your one-eyed bias was called out recently here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050094&viewfull=1#post1050094) and here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050106&viewfull=1#post1050106).



I find your posts entertaining - but not for the reasons you think.

Get some fresh air. It will do you wonders.[/COLOR]

Daytr is entertaining but enough is enough. I've turned him off. It feels like one is communicating with a machine programmed with lefty logic.

[RTM]

I decided a while ago that it’s not worth engaging with Daytr as he always right, always has to get the last word in, always, and is basically a drop kick. Once one realises that, things improve.

And yes, fresh air, perhaps leaving phone at home, is a great idea.

[Daytr]

Wanting a left leaning media to fail is not the same as wanting only a right wing media per your post. If you fail to understand this then your blinkers are showing: your one-eyed bias was called out recently here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050094&viewfull=1#post1050094) and here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050106&viewfull=1#post1050106).

Pointing out factual inaccuracies that were not addressed: recent examples here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050081&viewfull=1#post1050081) and here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050269&viewfull=1#post1050269).

Playing the race card: here (https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/showthread.php?12790-Nat-act-nzf-2023&p=1050075&viewfull=1#post1050075) which I will quote so everyone can see it.

That is appalling to play the race card given TGB was not talking about Maori getting coverage.

If you want to play the "whataboutism" game then I suggest you remove the beam from your own eye before removing the speck from mine. No mention from you about the appalling posts from your leftie mates. Hypocrite.

I find your posts entertaining - but not for the reasons you think.

Get some fresh air. It will do you wonders.[/COLOR]

Buddy you really need to understand what a fact is.

TGB wasn't clear what he was on about other than saying that there shouldn't be any conditions, but as I have said and as someone that has been involved in many funding applications, I have never seen one that didn't have conditions.

I don't need to have a crack at the minority of lefties on here, when there half a dozen rightcysts that will instantly hurl a constant barrage of abuse & insults at them & I'm not into bullying.

But your rightcysts mates behavior is acceptable to you.
I freely admit I see posts from both sides go over the top. But typically it's a constant litinay of ugliness from the same rightcyst posters who engage in degradation and abusive behavior and that sometimes causes a reaction. Hey but that's OK to turn a blind eye to eh, well I suppose it's easy when the other one is closed as well.

Are you and MistaTea related?
As you are starting make as many things up as he / she does.
Please take the time to look up the word fact in the meantime.
It will save us both a lot of time.

[Ferg]

I'm not your buddy.

You can't accept simple facts like the left wing media bias - you obviously know more than the researchers and publishers per the links. /tui

MistaTea and me related? Lol. That proves you are delusional.

If TGB wasn't clear in your view...then why did you jump to conclusions by playing the race card? Especially when you could have enquired instead given he stated his willingness to engage. You saw his final reply. Learn from it.

One thing we can agree on - if you are not going to criticise behaviour from one side, then don't criticise the same behaviour from the other. That works for me.

You just keep playing that race card and using logical fallacies all you like - see how that works out for you.

This isn't central station so we don't all need to announce our intentions....but I like the advice of MT, ynot and RTM and others. Enjoy screaming into the void.

[Daytr]

I'm not your buddy.

You can't accept simple facts like the left wing media bias - you obviously know more than the researchers and publishers per the links. /tui

MistaTea and me related? Lol. That proves you are delusional.

If TGB wasn't clear in your view...then why did you jump to conclusions by playing the race card? Especially when you could have enquired instead given he stated his willingness to engage. You saw his final reply. Learn from it.

One thing we can agree on - if you are not going to criticise behaviour from one side, then don't criticise the same behaviour from the other. That works for me.

You just keep playing that race card and using logical fallacies all you like - see how that works out for you.

This isn't central station so we don't all need to announce our intentions....but I like the advice of MT, ynot and RTM and others. Enjoy screaming into the void.

You finally found a fact. We aren't buddies correct.

You really don't understand what a fact is do you? However, perhaps you missed the post where I said something like a lot of journalists are want to be writers and the majority of people from the arts are left leaning so ergo it makes sense there is left leaning journalists. Just like their are numerous right wing ones.

And it hasn't prevented the mass media from having right wing columnists & journalists. I have named many of them recently.

The conditions were about race. I asked him what specifically they had a problem and they wouldn't answer, just that there shouldn't be any conditions. But there is always has been & always will be, but these conditions apparently are a problem.

The 'behaviour' is far more common from the Rightcysts posters on here. Some of them can hardly go a single post without abusing someone. So I find your comment disingenuous.

Same as your last comment, pretty well signaled I think. Thanks for taking my suggestion, at least I won't have to explain the definition of words like fact anymore...

[Daytr]

I decided a while ago that it’s not worth engaging with Daytr as he always right, always has to get the last word in, always, and is basically a drop kick. Once one realises that, things improve.

And yes, fresh air, perhaps leaving phone at home, is a great idea.

Thanks for the insult. Par for the course.

I have never once claimed to be right on an opinion. As it's subjective and it's an opinion.

But I do understand going by the comments on here from a lot of rightcyst voters, that they don't like other opinions be it in the media or on this site for that matter.

But each to their own. Half the reason I engage on these political threads is to hear different views from my own. But that doesn't mean I will agree with them, but I think it's important to know what people are thinking or see things outside your bubble.

I have been at home a lot lately as am recovering from a serious injury, what's Balance's excuse or more the point why has it not raised by any of you? Ahhh because he panders to the right whilst insulting the left.
Something I have seen sits well with some of you.

And yes I realise RTM may never read this.
Echo, echo....

[mistaTea]

I decided a while ago that it’s not worth engaging with Daytr as he always right, always has to get the last word in, always, and is basically a drop kick. Once one realises that, things improve.

And yes, fresh air, perhaps leaving phone at home, is a great idea.

I would have to agree with this 100%.

Daytr has allegedly put me on the ignore list in what he considers the ultimate punishment. LOL.

He does come across as a drop kick, and no matter what he will make sure he gets the last word - no matter how ridiculous he sounds.

I certainly do not miss the back and forth posts with him. Cannot take him seriously at all.

[mistaTea]

I'm not your buddy.

You can't accept simple facts like the left wing media bias - you obviously know more than the researchers and publishers per the links. /tui

MistaTea and me related? Lol. That proves you are delusional.

If TGB wasn't clear in your view...then why did you jump to conclusions by playing the race card? Especially when you could have enquired instead given he stated his willingness to engage. You saw his final reply. Learn from it.

One thing we can agree on - if you are not going to criticise behaviour from one side, then don't criticise the same behaviour from the other. That works for me.

You just keep playing that race card and using logical fallacies all you like - see how that works out for you.

This isn't central station so we don't all need to announce our intentions....but I like the advice of MT, ynot and RTM and others. Enjoy screaming into the void.

Yeah best to not engage with him.

It has been peaceful without having to engage in his bs.

I think he has a strong need to whip himself up into hysterics. Hence why he can never be wrong, considers himself impartial etc... posts in a supercillious manner no matter how absurd the content of his thoughts...

He makes sure he always gets the last word, and usually resorts to gaslighting and insults as a way to keep the engagement going so that he can continue to feed.

Not too different from Dandelo in Steve King's Dark Tower series (if it does ya).

If we stop feeding it, it cannot survive.

[Bjauck]

Flash mob style Palestinian Protest (against government policy) held outside Peters’ residence. Whether or not I support the cause, I think protests outside residences should definitely be off limits, and protesters immediately dispersed/arrested, day or night, for a breach of the peace. What do other posters think?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/winston-peters-targeted-flashmob-style-after-dark-as-tactics-shift-in-palestine-protest-movement/ICACMOE4B5CE5M3JRN3QPTZ22E/

[mistaTea]

Flash mob style Palestinian Protest (against government policy) held outside Peters’ residence. Whether or not I support the cause, I think protests outside residences should definitely be off limits, and protesters immediately dispersed/arrested, day or night, for a breach of the peace. What do other posters think?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/winston-peters-targeted-flashmob-style-after-dark-as-tactics-shift-in-palestine-protest-movement/ICACMOE4B5CE5M3JRN3QPTZ22E/

Yes I agree with you. Protesting outside someones private residence is going way too far. It starts to set a dangerous precident.

By all means, protest in a lawful way at Winnie's public events etc, but the private residence must be off limits.

[iceman]

Yes I agree with you. Protesting outside someones private residence is going way too far. It starts to set a dangerous precident.

By all means, protest in a lawful way at Winnie's public events etc, but the private residence must be off limits.

Agree. This is NEVER acceptable and should be dealt with harshly by Police.

[nztx]

Agree. This is NEVER acceptable and should be dealt with harshly by Police.


Ditto that too

[Joshuatree]

Thanks for the insult. Par for the course.

I have never once claimed to be right on an opinion. As it's subjective and it's an opinion.

But I do understand going by the comments on here from a lot of rightcyst voters, that they don't like other opinions be it in the media or on this site for that matter.

But each to their own. Half the reason I engage on these political threads is to hear different views from my own. But that doesn't mean I will agree with them, but I think it's important to know what people are thinking or see things outside your bubble.

I have been at home a lot lately as am recovering from a serious injury, what's Balance's excuse or more the point why has it not raised by any of you? Ahhh because he panders to the right whilst insulting the left.
Something I have seen sits well with some of you.

And yes I realise RTM may never read this.
Echo, echo....

Good on you Daytr.Keep taking on these people.Sone of them choose the ignore button because they don't want to face up to things,to many uncomfortable truths that this Cannibal Collective is bringing to our country.Othets reek of some sort of self entitlement and they will say ANYTHING to protect their position .
I see very little that this Govt is doing that's good ,just tearing down pretty much everything that came before.
One poll does not a trend make....yet
But when it shows 41% of kiwis disagree with fast tracking we know trouble lies ahead ehh

[Baa_Baa]

I see very little that this Govt is doing that's good ,just tearing down pretty much everything that came before.

Labour did exactly the same, fast tracking the tear down of National policies, many under urgency, especially when they had the unprecedented MMP majority. Slam dunk.

Now the shoe is on the other foot, the Labourites squeal like stuck pigs about tactics that they unequivocally used themselves. Lol at that!

And time has proven that "pretty much everything that came before" was a massive unadulterated failure, an extraordinary drain on the public purse, tax payer funded debacles, to achieve ... absolutely nothing in 6 years!

Which needs to be taken down, eliminated, reformed and rebuilt. The only question imo is whether the coalition can get it or some of it, done in the time they have until the next election.

Whatever your smoking JT, it's not working, and I suggest that you post earlier in the day rather than after the gins and smoke embolden you and distort your perceptions of reality.

[dln]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/whats-the-rush-comparing-national-and-labour-governments-use-of-urgency/7USMFGJAMLHNJ57JSGYOJQCV7A/
"Parliament has processes in place for lawmaking so we have a chance to debate them properly, fix any issues and hear views from the public," Seymour said.
"If the Government wanted good laws that didn't have unintended consequences it would stop forcing laws through under urgency."

[nztx]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/whats-the-rush-comparing-national-and-labour-governments-use-of-urgency/7USMFGJAMLHNJ57JSGYOJQCV7A/
"Parliament has processes in place for lawmaking so we have a chance to debate them properly, fix any issues and hear views from the public," Seymour said.
"If the Government wanted good laws that didn't have unintended consequences it would stop forcing laws through under urgency."

the previous lot of short sighted & badly wayward consequences have probably attracted further remediatiary consequences under urgency

they even managed a vast avalanche of rapid patch ups under urgency at the time ;)

Anyone care to guess who were peacefully sleeping when the first avalanches were being shoved through ? ;)


No amount of Parliamentary processes helped alleviate what was seen either :)


Hope they're having a peaceful holiday now reflecting on how they managed such remarkable feats ..


Look no further than Mahuta's Three Waters shambles :)

[Bjauck]

Labour did exactly the same, fast tracking the tear down of National policies, many under urgency, especially when they had the unprecedented MMP majority. Slam dunk.

Now the shoe is on the other foot, the Labourites squeal like stuck pigs about tactics that they unequivocally used themselves. Lol at that!

And time has proven that "pretty much everything that came before" was a massive unadulterated failure, an extraordinary drain on the public purse, tax payer funded debacles, to achieve ... absolutely nothing in 6 years!

Which needs to be taken down, eliminated, reformed and rebuilt. The only question imo is whether the coalition can get it or some of it, done in the time they have until the next election.

Whatever your smoking JT, it's not working, and I suggest that you post earlier in the day rather than after the gins and smoke embolden you and distort your perceptions of reality.
Urgency should be used sparingly. The full Parliamentary procedure is part of our hard won parliamentary system to ensure thorough debate on the proposed legislation. Whether it is Labour or National “squealing like stuck pigs” at fast tracking, I applaud them for bringing the government of the day to account for the “urgency” behind the fast tracking.

Opposition parties “squealed” as they should have about the urgency employed by the Labour Govt after QE2’s death.https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/reckless-and-irresponsible-govt-urgently-pushing-through-24-bills-after-queens-death-caused-lost-time/4HWDAV7SHFHPXJRHKA2SHXRGSI/

A normal election cycle or the parliamentary time lost as a result of the death of our longest serving sovereign - which would be a more valid reason for urgency?

I think neither as the threshold needs to be high when a large array of pieces of legislation are given urgency.

[Joshuatree]

Labour did exactly the same, fast tracking the tear down of National policies, many under urgency, especially when they had the unprecedented MMP majority. Slam dunk.

Now the shoe is on the other foot, the Labourites squeal like stuck pigs about tactics that they unequivocally used themselves. Lol at that!

And time has proven that "pretty much everything that came before" was a massive unadulterated failure, an extraordinary drain on the public purse, tax payer funded debacles, to achieve ... absolutely nothing in 6 years!

Which needs to be taken down, eliminated, reformed and rebuilt. The only question imo is whether the coalition can get it or some of it, done in the time they have until the next election.

Whatever your smoking JT, it's not working, and I suggest that you post earlier in the day rather than after the gins and smoke embolden you and distort your perceptions of reality.

Usual insults from Baaa,welcome back mate.The only thing that is correct is that some labour policies didn't completely work and many did not have enough time to work.Meanwhile with 41% opposed to fast tracking ,we have Luxon and The Sniper ballsing it up and misinforming,talk about incompetence.

"Prime Minister and Corrections Minister repeatedly provided incorrect information about their planned prison spend-up.

The announcement promised a $1.9 billion investment in Corrections over the next four years.

The near 40-minute media conference raised almost more questions than answers - with Christopher Luxon and Mark Mitchell at times contradicting each other" Radio NZ

[Balance]

A shocker!

Hope they deliver much better than their verbal delivery!

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/516128/contradictions-and-confusion-more-questions-than-answers-at-government-press-conference

[Daytr]

A shocker!

Hope they deliver much better than their verbal delivery!

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/516128/contradictions-and-confusion-more-questions-than-answers-at-government-press-conference

Yeah Keystone cops for sure.
What should have been a positive announcement becomes a joke and also raises questions around both the PM & Minister's knowledge they are basing their decision making on.

This summary is quite comical.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/politics/350269374/very-confounding-government-press-conference

[Balance]

Yeah Keystone cops for sure.
What should have been a positive announcement becomes a joke and also raises questions around both the PM & Minister's knowledge they are basing their decision making on.

This summary is quite comical.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/politics/350269374/very-confounding-government-press-conference

Wise sayings from history and from those with experience :

"A man is judged by his deeds, not his words.

A man of words and not of deeds is like a garden of weeds.

A man should be ashamed when his deeds not match his words."

After 6 years of the Labour government of words (spin & BS basically), NZ better wise up and learn to judge any government based upon what is achieved rather than what is spoken.

Words are of course important because words can inspire and lift a whole country to better and greater things. Ultimately though, words are but words without deeds.

[Daytr]

Wise sayings from history and from those with experience :

"A man is judged by his deeds, not his words.

A man of words and not of deeds is like a garden of weeds.

A man should be ashamed when his deeds not match his words."

After 6 years of the Labour government of words (spin & BS basically), NZ better wise up and learn to judge any government based upon what is achieved rather than what is spoken.

Words are of course important because words can inspire and lift a whole country to better and greater things. Ultimately though, words are but words without deeds.

If you are hosting a press conference, words are pretty much everything.

And if you don't know the detail of what your decisions are based on, then the outcome is a lottery.

[Balance]

If you are hosting a press conference, words are pretty much everything.

And if you don't know the detail of what your decisions are based on, then the outcome is a lottery.

No question that Mark Mitchell fxxked up and made Luxon looked stupid.

Second strike btw for Mark.

More’s the pity for the government as the announcement (per article below) was a very positive one :

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/corrections-minister-mark-mitchell-demonstrates-how-not-to-make-a-budget-announcement-audrey-young/YYL2JS7R3ZDCFAVNWXCLWX3XNQ/

“Once the clarifying statement arrived after the press conference, it was clear they had under-sold the announcement. It turned out that the Government is promising $1.9 billion more for Corrections over four years than the current spending track. That will fund more prison beds, more prison staff and more rehabilitation programmes for remand prisoners who make up 45 per cent of the prison muster.

For the record, the clarification sent out afterwards by Mark Mitchell’s office stated there are currently 455 beds at Waikeria Prison; that 600 new ones under way already will come on line in a year, including 100 mental health beds; and that yesterday’s funding announcement will mean an additional 810 beds which, once completed, will take Waikeria’s capacity to a whopping 1865 beds.“

[Daytr]

No question that Mark Mitchell fxxked up and made Luxon looked stupid.

Second strike btw for Mark.

More’s the pity for the government as the announcement (per article below) was a very positive one :

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/corrections-minister-mark-mitchell-demonstrates-how-not-to-make-a-budget-announcement-audrey-young/YYL2JS7R3ZDCFAVNWXCLWX3XNQ/

“Once the clarifying statement arrived after the press conference, it was clear they had under-sold the announcement. It turned out that the Government is promising $1.9 billion more for Corrections over four years than the current spending track. That will fund more prison beds, more prison staff and more rehabilitation programmes for remand prisoners who make up 45 per cent of the prison muster.

For the record, the clarification sent out afterwards by Mark Mitchell’s office stated there are currently 455 beds at Waikeria Prison; that 600 new ones under way already will come on line in a year, including 100 mental health beds; and that yesterday’s funding announcement will mean an additional 810 beds which, once completed, will take Waikeria’s capacity to a whopping 1865 beds.“

Good clarification.
But one way it could be looked at is they expect serious crime to increase.

[Balance]

Good clarification.
But one way it could be looked at is they expect serious crime to increase.

They have made clear they want criminals, especially those guilty of violent crimes, to be locked up rather than be given home detention.

The sort of crime which should see this low life scumbag criminal jailed for at least 3 years - unprovoked assault by a 43 year old (wearing pink pants) on an 80+ old elderly woman:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/516147/watch-elderly-woman-knocked-to-the-ground-in-unprovoked-attack

[Balance]

Clearly more jails needed …

An example of what happens with Labour’s soft approach to criminals - this criminal has committed murder by firing multiple shots on Ponsonby Rd.

He should have been locked up for a spell to reflect on what punishment is truly about - he wasn’t and now, a life is lost.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/350270268/man-wanted-relation-ponsonby-rd-shooting-named

Sentenced to community detention after being convicted for assault to injure, for breaching bail and then, for breaching community detention condition.

[mistaTea]

No question that Mark Mitchell fxxked up and made Luxon looked stupid.

Second strike btw for Mark.

More’s the pity for the government as the announcement (per article below) was a very positive one :

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/corrections-minister-mark-mitchell-demonstrates-how-not-to-make-a-budget-announcement-audrey-young/YYL2JS7R3ZDCFAVNWXCLWX3XNQ/

“Once the clarifying statement arrived after the press conference, it was clear they had under-sold the announcement. It turned out that the Government is promising $1.9 billion more for Corrections over four years than the current spending track. That will fund more prison beds, more prison staff and more rehabilitation programmes for remand prisoners who make up 45 per cent of the prison muster.

For the record, the clarification sent out afterwards by Mark Mitchell’s office stated there are currently 455 beds at Waikeria Prison; that 600 new ones under way already will come on line in a year, including 100 mental health beds; and that yesterday’s funding announcement will mean an additional 810 beds which, once completed, will take Waikeria’s capacity to a whopping 1865 beds.“

Yeah Mark needs to pull his socks up big time. Totally muffed a really positive announcement.

I don't think Luxon will accept being made to look foolish again.

It would be lovely if we did not need to expand out prison capacity so much... if the soft on crime "let's all be more understanding" approach actually worked. But we live in the real world, and there are more bad buggers out there than ever before - and a lot of them need to be locked up, with reahbilitation opportunities to try and turn their lives around.

The next thing I want removed is the discounts on sentencing that come on the back of cultural reports. First step is to stop funding the reports with taxpayer dollars, but I actually want it scrapped altogether.

Most criminals who do these serious crimes assault/GBH/murder/robbery etc... have had tough lives growing up. And no doubt that contributes to where they end up as an adult... however if you do the crime, you must do the (full) time.

It is very difficult for families of the victims to see someone get a further 10% or so discount on their sentence because the criminal was Maori and had a sh1t step dad. All that background information is valuable in terms of helping society try to identify these situations early and intervene where possible... but where a serious crime is committed, all bets are off and the full punishment must be set.

[causecelebre]

Not quite sure where to add this but not only have the Wellington public servants been troughing on the tax payers dime for the last 6 years but now it turns out they need sheltered workshops sponsored by that great woke establishment: Victoria University. Yes, that same institution that cancelled (literally and culturally) a panel on free speech because one on the intended panelists supported free speech (yes, really, you can't make that sh!t up). Remember, NZ tax payers make up 42% of university funding. Good to see my hard earned going to support bleeding hearts

https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350270906/public-servant-scholarship-launched-victoria-university

[Bjauck]

Not quite sure where to add this but not only have the Wellington public servants been troughing on the tax payers dime for the last 6 years but now it turns out they need sheltered workshops sponsored by that great woke establishment: Victoria University. Yes, that same institution that cancelled (literally and culturally) a panel on free speech because one on the intended panelists supported free speech (yes, really, you can't make that sh!t up). Remember, NZ tax payers make up 42% of university funding. Good to see my hard earned going to support bleeding hearts

https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350270906/public-servant-scholarship-launched-victoria-university

If Victoria is a woke establishment - and presumably you think that is a bad thing? Do you think safeguards should be brought to in stop Universities becoming woke and what would those safeguards be?

It looks like the VU free speech debate is back on anyway: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/515928/free-speech-debate-back-on-as-victoria-university-expands-diversity-on-panel

[causecelebre]

If Victoria is a woke establishment - and presumably you think that is a bad thing? Do you think safeguards should be brought to in stop Universities becoming woke and what would those safeguards be?

It looks like the VU free speech debate is back on anyway: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/515928/free-speech-debate-back-on-as-victoria-university-expands-diversity-on-panel

Nope, I'd like Universities to be places of education for every one without affirmative action and not have small special interest groups dominating the discourse and allowing all views. Anyone that does not toe the progressive line is cancelled and is not in a "safe place". Students that publicly vocalise opinions that do not follow the VUSU point of view suffer not only harassment on campus but very real career risk.

I'm not surprised the debate is back on. Marcail Parkinson got publicly roasted on her inability to provide any evidence that Johnathon Ayling and the Free Speech Union incited hate speech as the VUSU expounded. It was simply cancel culture at its worst

[Bjauck]

Nope, I'd like Universities to be places of education for every one without affirmative action and not have small special interest groups dominating the discourse and allowing all views. Anyone that does not toe the progressive line is cancelled and is not in a "safe place". Students that publicly vocalise opinions that do not follow the VUSU point of view suffer not only harassment on campus but very real career risk.

I'm not surprised the debate is back on. Marcail Parkinson got publicly roasted on her inability to provide any evidence that Johnathon Ayling and the Free Speech Union incited hate speech as the VUSU expounded. It was simply cancel culture at its worst However he is not being cancelled. The University is holding an event in which he is included. There was a debate about the debate and a revised format established! Some students had expressed their concern at the original structure and possibility it could be a platform for hate speech.

With respect to the harassed students, are they bullied/harassed by other students or by the University administration how are they harassed and what career risk do they face?

[mistaTea]

David Seymour just posted:


We just saved you $107 million on school lunches.

And despite the shrieking from the left, we’re not cancelling the programme.


The reality is Labour did not budget for free school lunches past this year. By making tough choices, we’re able to keep funding the programme and do more with less money.


We’ll be feeding kids in schools the fruit and sandwiches their parents would give them, not woke food like quinoa and sushi.


We’re going to be saving $107 million on the programme, and more kids will be eligible for lunches. That’s the kind of problem solving we need to stop Government waste and treat your tax dollars with respect.


Bon appétit.

[blackcap]

David Seymour just posted:

Who the hell would feed kids Quinoa and Sushi? Are people that retarded?

Heck, I'm in my mid 40's now and can appreciate Quinoa now and then but as a kid that SIHT would go straight into the bin.

[mistaTea]

Who the hell would feed kids Quinoa and Sushi? Are people that retarded?

Heck, I'm in my mid 40's now and can appreciate Quinoa now and then but as a kid that SIHT would go straight into the bin.


Yeah for sure, earlier reports showed that a lot of kids did not eat the food so there was a lot of waste.

Part of that would be due to them ripping the ring out of it by trying to be too 'healthy' with the good.

At the end of the day, if the taxpayer is going to foot the bill... we do have to provide food that the kids will actually eat, in a cost-effective way.

We do want the food to have nutritional value (so we probably shouldn't be feeding them a pie and a coke), but we don't need to get carried away. The main thing is that these underpriviledged kids are getting something that they will eat.

Some common sense perhaps?

[Bjauck]

Who the hell would feed kids Quinoa and Sushi? Are people that retarded?
Heck, I'm in my mid 40's now and can appreciate Quinoa now and then but as a kid that SIHT would go straight into the bin. Didn't Seymour invent that outrage? As far as I understand nobody - not even the previous government - had suggested school lunches consist of quinoa and sushi. Quinoa and sushi sound sufficiently champagne socialist for Seymour to create outrage against. However I think he was trying to add a bit of humour to make his point, which is also his manner.

I am in my 50's and like sushi and hummus but I would put quinoa in the compost bin unless I had nothing else to eat!

I think energetic kids could metabolise fat and sugar more effectively - as part of a balanced diet - than more sedentary adults.

Maybe different areas could have different foods. So if a trial of quinoa salad works in Ponsonby schools lunches, for example, and it is cost effective, they should run with it.

[mistaTea]

Didn't Seymour invent that outrage? As far as I understand nobody - not even the previous government - had suggested school lunches consist of quinoa and sushi. Quinoa and sushi sound sufficiently champagne socialist for Seymour to create outrage against. However I think he was trying to add a bit of humour to make his point, which is also his manner.

I am in my 50's and like sushi and hummus but I would put quinoa in the compost bin unless I had nothing else to eat!

I think energetic kids could metabolise fat and sugar more effectively - as part of a balanced diet - than more sedentary adults.

Maybe different areas could have different foods. So if a trial of quinoa salad works in Ponsonby schools lunches, for example, and it is cost effective, they should run with it.

Mate, if the taxpayer ever starts paying for lunches in Ponsoby, we riot.

[Bjauck]

Mate, if the taxpayer ever starts paying for lunches in Ponsoby, we riot. There is social housing in Freemans Bay/Ponsonby. We pay for Accommodation supplements and Ponsonby pensioners. It is not all yuppies.

[blackcap]

Didn't Seymour invent that outrage? As far as I understand nobody - not even the previous government - had suggested school lunches consist of quinoa and sushi. Quinoa and sushi sound sufficiently champagne socialist for Seymour to create outrage against. However I think he was trying to add a bit of humour to make his point, which is also his manner.

I am in my 50's and like sushi and hummus but I would put quinoa in the compost bin unless I had nothing else to eat!

I think energetic kids could metabolise fat and sugar more effectively - as part of a balanced diet - than more sedentary adults.

Maybe different areas could have different foods. So if a trial of quinoa salad works in Ponsonby schools lunches, for example, and it is cost effective, they should run with it.

Definitely, kids can easily have a pie and coke, but even a good old fashioned ham and cheese sandwich on white bread would be great to give kids a good start to the day.

That said, I am against lunches in schools and if parents do not provide their kids with lunch, they are failing in one of their core responsibilities. Maybe CYPS needs to pay them a visit.

[Bjauck]

Definitely, kids can easily have a pie and coke, but even a good old fashioned ham and cheese sandwich on white bread would be great to give kids a good start to the day.

That said, I am against lunches in schools and if parents do not provide their kids with lunch, they are failing in one of their core responsibilities. Maybe CYPS needs to pay them a visit. If parents who cannot/do not feed their kids just ended up "punishing" their own kids, that would be one issue. Hungry/malnourished kids often end up with behavioural issues, and poor school performance. So other kids are affected and eventually the wider society too.

[blackcap]

If parents who cannot/do not feed their kids just ended up "punishing" their own kids, that would be one issue. Hungry/malnourished kids often end up with behavioural issues, and poor school performance. So other kids are affected and eventually the wider society too.

Correct, so the parents of these malnourised kids should be targeted and told to buck up their ideas.

[Baa_Baa]

Correct, so the parents of these malnourised kids should be targeted and told to buck up their ideas.

What if the parent(s) don't have the money or the means, or jobs to earn the money, to feed their kids? That's the problem 'school lunches' is trying to fix, it's not every school, it's for the deprived schools.

We can't fix the problem of bringing more and more children into deprived families, or improve parenting to 'buck up their ideas' by feeding them at school, all we can fix is that they go to school, are fed and educated, hopefully breaking the cycle of deprivation.

I suggest all the hardliners amongst us who don't have any real sense of the deprivation that exists in NZ, and what it means to family and community, regardless of race, take a roady around the East Cape, carry on to Northland, travel back down the west coast of Northland to Dargaville etc. And open your eyes to reality.

[blackcap]

What if the parent(s) don't have the money or the means, or jobs to earn the money, to feed their kids? That's the problem 'school lunches' is trying to fix, it's not every school, it's for the deprived schools.

We can't fix the problem of bringing more and more children into deprived families, or improve parenting to 'buck up their ideas' by feeding them at school, all we can fix is that they go to school, are fed and educated, hopefully breaking the cycle of deprivation.

I suggest all the hardliners amongst us who don't have any real sense of the deprivation that exists in NZ, and what it means to family and community, regardless of race, take a roady around the East Cape, carry on to Northland, travel back down the west coast of Northland to Dargaville etc. And open your eyes to reality.

For right or wrong most of this so called hardship is self inflicted. It has to do with lifestyle choices etc. Priorities and responsibility. Something that has sadly been lacking for quite a while now. Maybe those things should be taught in our schools rather than some of the other rubbish.

[blackcap]

...........

[Aaron]

For right or wrong most of this so called hardship is self inflicted. It has to do with lifestyle choices etc. Priorities and responsibility. Something that has sadly been lacking for quite a while now. Maybe those things should be taught in our schools rather than some of the other rubbish.

Agree with blackcap that you need to take responsibility for yourself and your family first and foremost and that possibly in a lot of cases the hardship might be self inflicted (drugs, lack of a budget etc) but punishing the kids for being born to sh*t bag parents is not the solution.

I agree more with Baa Baa that all we can fix is that they go to school, are fed and educated, hopefully breaking the cycle of deprivation.

I suppose we could bring in a capital gains tax to lower income taxes that way capital owners can contribute to the nation as well as the people trading time for money and the wage slaves keep more to spend on food for their kids.

Perhaps monetary policy that focuses on price stability rather than inflation which as we all know is a regressive tax that helps asset owners while making life harder for the working man should be reconsidered. Get some proof other than a widening gap between rich and poor that trickle down economics works before continuing with failing policy.

And speaking of regressive taxes maybe we should tell the next person to suggest an increase in GST to cut income tax to shut the f*ck up.

[mistaTea]

Agree with blackcap that you need to take responsibility for yourself and your family first and foremost and that possibly in a lot of cases the hardship might be self inflicted (drugs, lack of a budget etc) but punishing the kids for being born to sh*t bag parents is not the solution.

I agree more with Baa Baa that all we can fix is that they go to school, are fed and educated, hopefully breaking the cycle of deprivation.

It is a challenging situation. And both Blackcap and Baa_Baa are right.

For the most part, parents not feeding their kids is due to choices. The parents could feed them, but choose to blow their money on other unecessary bs. In that light, why should the taxpayer be expected to subsidise these 'bad parents' poor choices?

On the other hand, these are young kids we are talking about. It is literally not their fault that their parents are sh1t. Do we not have some sort of collective responsibility to help? The thought of some of these kids at school with no food makes me want to weep. And Baa_Baa is right that it does understandably lead to more behavioural issues, which affects all of the pupils, and also then ensures the cycle is repeated for these kids.

And then there are a smaller minority of families where there is a genuine need.

For me, though I wish we did not live in a society where the taxpayer had to foot the bill for feeding other peoples kids... in the end, if the govt can target the areas in need and do it in a cost effective way...with reasonable choices of food available (not platters of sushi) then let's keep it going and review the results periodically.

[Aaron]

, why should the taxpayer be expected to subsidise these 'bad parents' poor choices?

Because we as a nation are not sh*tbags like these poor kids parents. That would be my best guess.

Also looking at the figures a single parent on minimum wage working 40hours a week earns $47,216 annually less tax $39,933 or $768 a week in the hand. Average rents nationally per google are $530 a week or $27,560 That leaves $12,373 or $238 a week to cover the groceries, power, insurance, vehicle running costs, clothes etc. That is going to be a tight budget.

We should factor in accommodation supplements (this does not seem to engender as much concern as lunches for kids for some reason) and working for families but I need to do some work today.

Some of us have been blessed with parents who loved us and cared for us and have helped and encouraged us to contribute to society, also some of us are blessed with good looks and brains so our position in life is not all down to hard work and personal responsibility, although they are admirable qualities in a person.

If the average house price per google is say $900,000 then a home owner could expect a govt guaranteed gain of at least $18,000 ($900,0000 *2%) tax free a year. Why should the nz taxpayer have to suffer inflation to protect the price of peoples houses and reduce their debts in real terms?

The answer to this one is that homeowners vote more than poor people and MPs own houses.

[mistaTea]

Because we as a nation are not sh*tbags like these poor kids parents. That would be my best guess.

Yes, but the question is still valid.

As I say, it is a difficult situation.

And those who take a black and white view of it on either side of the spectrum of views can become unreasonable in different ways.

[Aaron]

Yes, but the question is still valid.

As I say, it is a difficult situation.

Agreed I just don't have the time to sort it out so I pay my taxes and hope for the best.

All credit to David Seymour though if what was in the paper is true. Saving $100million of taxpayer money a year AND feeding the kids. I like both of those things so maybe he is not all bad and there is a middle ground somewhere, although it will never be fair or perfect.

[Daytr]

Correct, so the parents of these malnourised kids should be targeted and told to buck up their ideas.

And who is going to go around to these so called parents and wag a finger in their face & say, buck up your ideas! There problem solved.

I suggest send David Seymour to some of the gang parents, see what sort of response he gets.

Food or nourishment supplied at schools is not a new thing. I remember when milk was supplied & orange juice for a while. I think milk is still supplied by Fonterra.

Where Seymour has failed after all his bluster, is that he was right, there is an incredible amount of waste with the program. I know a teacher at a school that would be considered an under privileged area and half the food probably goes to waste, or not eaten by students is probably a fairer assessment.

I don't know why he didn't just implement a system now, where kids make an order, I.e those who need it get it & even if the school allowed for another 10 or 15% over for kids who didn't order who should have etc, it would still save a shed load of money.

[Aaron]

Yes, but the question is still valid.

As I say, it is a difficult situation.

And those who take a black and white view of it on either side of the spectrum of views can become unreasonable in different ways.

Also I recall reading your earlier views on raising GST, not a personal attack in post 3135 just my humble uneducated opinion on regressive taxes.

[mistaTea]

Also I recall reading your earlier views on raising GST, not a personal attack in post 3135 just my humble uneducated opinion on regressive taxes.

There are valid arguments for various different tax models. We should always be prepared to revisit and debate. I know other places like the UK have 20% VAT. They also have various stamp duty taxes and some form of CGT I think.

It is worth pointing out though, taxes are always regressive. No matter which way you cut it. Even when you try to target the rich with higher taxes, in practice it is the poor who end up paying for it.

No perfect system, we do the best we can.

[Bjauck]

It is a challenging situation. And both Blackcap and Baa_Baa are right.

For the most part, parents not feeding their kids is due to choices. The parents could feed them, but choose to blow their money on other unecessary bs. In that light, why should the taxpayer be expected to subsidise these 'bad parents' poor choices?

On the other hand, these are young kids we are talking about. It is literally not their fault that their parents are sh1t. Do we not have some sort of collective responsibility to help? The thought of some of these kids at school with no food makes me want to weep. And Baa_Baa is right that it does understandably lead to more behavioural issues, which affects all of the pupils, and also then ensures the cycle is repeated for these kids.

And then there are a smaller minority of families where there is a genuine need.

For me, though I wish we did not live in a society where the taxpayer had to foot the bill for feeding other peoples kids... in the end, if the govt can target the areas in need and do it in a cost effective way...with reasonable choices of food available (not platters of sushi) then let's keep it going and review the results periodically.
Are you ok footing the bill through accommodation supplements for their accommodation? Is it the sign of well-functioning country when a substantial proportion of the population, including many in employment, need taxpayer assistance to afford accommodation? Yet many begrudge school lunches provided for children, who have not even had the opportunity to stuff up their lives or country!

[Aaron]

It is worth pointing out though, taxes are always regressive. No matter which way you cut it. Even when you try to target the rich with higher taxes, in practice it is the poor who end up paying for it.

Agreed GST has its positives it is easy to implement, it eventually catches the cash economy when they spend at a legitimate business, in a world concerned with climate change it taxes consumers and consumption. Also if income allows you can choose to save and invest rather than spend and avoid GST altogether.

I don't agree with your statement above. It is well known that the wealthy contribute a very large portion of the tax take. NZs income tax is not regressive everyone pays 10.5% on the first $14k no matter how much you earn. As you earn more you pay more for each dollar of earnings as you hit the higher tax bands.

Skim reading the paper this morning there was something about the IRD put one of Eric Watson's companies into liquidation over tax debt

[mistaTea]

Agreed GST has its positives it is easy to implement, it eventually catches the cash economy when they spend at a legitimate business, in a world concerned with climate change it taxes consumers and consumption. Also if income allows you can choose to save and invest rather than spend and avoid GST altogether.

I don't agree with your statement above. It is well known that the wealthy contribute a very large portion of the tax take. NZs income tax is not regressive everyone pays 10.5% on the first $14k no matter how much you earn. As you earn more you pay more for each dollar of earnings as you hit the higher tax bands.

Skim reading the paper this morning there was something about the IRD put one of Eric Watson's companies into liquidation over tax debt

I think what I was going for in terms of "all taxes are regressive" comment was that you find as corporate taxes and individual taxes go up... so do the cost of things as companies and individuals want to be 'made whole again'.

This is an oversimplification, however let's say I am a 'rich pr1ck' working at some big bank. I am currently on $1M a year and I pay an effective tax rate of 25%.

The govt wants to tax 'rich pricks' like me, so they add a new tax band with a high percentage. Let's say that they really ratchet up the tax in this new band so that now my effective tax rate is 35%.

So I have gone from having a $250K tax bill to a $350K tax bill.

Well, I am not happy about that and will want to be made whole again or else I will take my valuable skills elsewhere. So, over time, you see the company needing to bump up my pay and benefits more than they would have otherwise. And that cost will in one shape or another be passed on to the consumer... the poorest of which feel those increased costs the most.

Same thing for Company tax.

Some of the new tax gets absorbed by the company/individual... but I think a lot of it is ultimately paid for by the 'poor'.

[mistaTea]

Are you ok footing the bill through accommodation supplements for their accommodation? Is it the sign of well-functioning country when a substantial proportion of the population, including many in employment, need taxpayer assistance to afford accommodation? Yet many begrudge school lunches provided for children, who have not even had the opportunity to stuff up their lives or country!

I think I have done a fairly decent job of treading the middle ground on this. Not sure I am really disagreeing with anyone on the school lunch issue, though I point out it is a difficult issue and there are some valid points on both sides.

With regards to WFF credits. Well, that amounts to a subsidy for employers. I wish we did not have this scheme at all.

And though there is an argument to scrap it because employers should pay a living wage, I accept the reality of the situation - some bad employers won't, and some actually can't. So we have the WFF scheme so that taxpayers effectively pay some wages.

It is not ideal, but life goes on and the sky has not fallen.

The same will ultimately be true for school lunches. Life will go on.

And I expect that if the changes Seymour has made are successful and the scheme is sustainable it will be in place for good, and possibly expand to more schools.

Not even this conservative government... despite all of ACT's bluster over the issue leading up to the election... no government wants to be the one to snatch away lunches from hungry kids. And so, Seymour had to change his views and make it work.

Overall, I feel better knowing these kids have some food, even though I think it is a shame it has had to come to taxpayers funding it.

[Aaron]

The govt wants to tax 'rich pricks' like me, so they add a new tax band with a high percentage. Let's say that they really ratchet up the tax in this new band so that now my effective tax rate is 35%.

So I have gone from having a $250K tax bill to a $350K tax bill.

Well, I am not happy about that and will want to be made whole again or else I will take my valuable skills elsewhere. So, over time, you see the company needing to bump up my pay and benefits more than they would have otherwise. And that cost will in one shape or another be passed on to the consumer... the poorest of which feel those increased costs the most.

Same thing for Company tax.

Some of the new tax gets absorbed by the company/individual... but I think a lot of it is ultimately paid for by the 'poor'.

So looking at it another way, if you reduce taxes on wealthy people they will want to move here with their capital and life will get easier for poor people?

Are you David Seymour?

Is another form of this argument, remove interest deductibility for landlords and the tax increase will go onto rents, reintroduce interest deductibility and rents will be reduced (yeah right get me a tuis)?

Every time there is talk of tax the THREAT of capital flight comes up or the perennial "the really rich don't pay tax so why bother" argument, or in your case the "ultimately the poor will end up paying in some way or other so why bother".

To me it is a strong argument to try and reduce the concentration of wealth and power in fewer and fewer hands so that they cannot hold an entire nation to ransom every time they don't like something being proposed by the democratically elected govt.

I have listened to Arthur Laffer of Laffer curve fame. Perhaps it is just the level we need to decide on.

[jonu]

So looking at it another way, if you reduce taxes on wealthy people they will want to move here with their capital and life will get easier for poor people?

Are you David Seymour?

Is another form of this argument, remove interest deductibility for landlords and the tax increase will go onto rents, reintroduce interest deductibility and rents will be reduced (yeah right get me a tuis)?

Every time there is talk of tax the THREAT of capital flight comes up or the perennial "the really rich don't pay tax so why bother" argument, or in your case the "ultimately the poor will end up paying in some way or other so why bother".

To me it is a strong argument to try and reduce the concentration of wealth and power in fewer and fewer hands so that they cannot hold an entire nation to ransom every time they don't like something being proposed by the democratically elected govt.

I have listened to Arthur Laffer of Laffer curve fame. Perhaps it is just the level we need to decide on.

For me you're ignoring the important part of the equation, as have multiple governments. Productivity. Grow the pie so the tax take grows and over time, tax rates cut. Very few governments spend my tax well. I certainly don't want to see government expenditure increasing as a proportion of GDP. I want it shrinking. That doesn't mean the $ spend needs to shrink. Grow the pie!

[Panda-NZ-]

Well, I am not happy about that and will want to be made whole again or else I will take my valuable skills elsewhere. So, over time, you see the company needing to bump up my pay and benefits more than they would have otherwise. And that cost will in one shape or another be passed on to the consumer... the poorest of which feel those increased costs the most.


Then your competitors will take your work on.

Some actually won't pass on costs.. and that's where your argument collapses. They will pressure "entitled" incumbents to reduce prices or lose market share.

[mistaTea]

So looking at it another way, if you reduce taxes on wealthy people they will want to move here with their capital and life will get easier for poor people?

Are you David Seymour?

Is another form of this argument, remove interest deductibility for landlords and the tax increase will go onto rents, reintroduce interest deductibility and rents will be reduced (yeah right get me a tuis)?

Every time there is talk of tax the THREAT of capital flight comes up or the perennial "the really rich don't pay tax so why bother" argument, or in your case the "ultimately the poor will end up paying in some way or other so why bother".

To me it is a strong argument to try and reduce the concentration of wealth and power in fewer and fewer hands so that they cannot hold an entire nation to ransom every time they don't like something being proposed by the democratically elected govt.

I have listened to Arthur Laffer of Laffer curve fame. Perhaps it is just the level we need to decide on.

I don't think what you have said makes my comment about 'the poor' ultimately footing the bill when taxes go up untrue.

I do agree with a CGT in principle, but it is such a hot button for many in this country that the prospect of getting anything over the line any time soon (by the time they work out the million exemptions needed to keep everyone happy from owner-occupiers to Maori...)

And it is true that when you introduce a new tax (either by inventing a new tax, or removing something like interest deductibility)... though it tends to be inflationary when introduced, it is not necessarily deflationary if reversed later. It is not efficient that way. If a landlord has put the rent up $30/week because he can't deduct interest, it is highly unlikely he will reduce the rent by $30/week all these years later.

And who gets hit with that double whammy? The poor.

And to be clear, I am not saying I am against increasing/changing taxes. Just pointing out that we need to be thoughtful when changing things, because any new taxes may not quite end up hitting the intended targer.

And I would be happy to pay higher taxes if my government is proven to use that money wisely and develop world class infrastructure, healthcare, education, law and order etc etc. Scandinavians pay high taxes and seem pretty happy. I have been to Copenhagen, and it is just stunning. I was even transported around the place with a driverless train that was on time, every time.

Where we get annoyed is when taxes go up, and there is little to show for it.

[Bjauck]

For me you're ignoring the important part of the equation, as have multiple governments. Productivity. Grow the pie so the tax take grows and over time, tax rates cut. Very few governments spend my tax well. I certainly don't want to see government expenditure increasing as a proportion of GDP. I want it shrinking. That doesn't mean the $ spend needs to shrink. Grow the pie! I agree. We do need more productive businesses paying more productive employees. NZ needs to be the country where productive and growth companies want to remain. However it will take a big (and uncomfortable for some) shift in policy and investment priorities

[Panda-NZ-]

Become part of Australia; businesses win, workers win... residential landlords not so much (stamp duty, cgt, land taxes).

[Aaron]

For me you're ignoring the important part of the equation, as have multiple governments. Productivity. Grow the pie so the tax take grows and over time, tax rates cut. Very few governments spend my tax well. I certainly don't want to see government expenditure increasing as a proportion of GDP. I want it shrinking. That doesn't mean the $ spend needs to shrink. Grow the pie!

If increased productivity and growth were that easy to achieve govt and more importantly private businesses and individuals would be doing it.

It sounds like a good idea but I think I read somewhere that productivity has decreased in the information age. Mine has today thanks to online communication, that’s for sure.

Growing the pie sounds better than sharing the pie. Although I think we have confused growth with inflation with our out of control immigration growing GDP and rents but reducing GDP per head and our monetary policies which grew/grow house prices and debt with not a lot of additional goods or services to show for it.

On another topic, Aussie is a popular destination for millionaries according to Barrons.

https://www.barrons.com/articles/millionaires-are-moving-to-these-countries-in-droves-65698dfb

Safety, a lower cost of living, favorable tax regimes and a high quality of life are top reasons for high-net-worth individuals to migrate.
“Australia consistently attracts sizable numbers of millionaires every year, mainly from Asia and Africa, but more recently also from high-income countries such as the U.K.,” according to Andrew Amoils, head of research at New World Wealth, which teamed up with Henley & Partners for the report.

I wonder if the millionaries from Asia and Africa and young NZers understand the world according to mistatea. Australia has a top tax rate of 45% as well as a capital gains tax and a GST. Surely people should be moving from Aussie to NZ or Asia or Africa instead.

Govt spending and govt debt to GDP seems similar in both NZ and Aussie but is that possible if NZs tax rates are lower? Maybe Aussie's tax free lower threshold and no GST on basic foodstuffs even things out overall. That would mean Australia is taxing its wealthiest a lot more than in NZ.

I guess taxation is passed onto the poorest Australians according to mistatea’s earlier example. The poor people in NZ should be thankful they are not in Australia with our tax system spreading the load more evenly so they are taxed directly rather than through mistatea’s indirect regressive transmission mechanisms.

Wouldn’t lower taxes and smaller govt make Australia even better? Apparently it is the solution to our problems here in NZ although we have no examples of this being true in the real world.

Taxes or penalising success as John Key calls it, are not the answer to everything I agree but to get back to the original argument as I am now just rambling on pointlessly, is it that bad asking the well off to chip in to feed some poor kids.

[Balance]

Another week, another poll.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/government-holds-on-in-latest-poll-christopher-luxons-favourability-surges/XNBVRE4KAJHFXBHGIU7CZ3XIEM/

Wonder if Sherman will pounce around like a demented sex deprived dog on heat while covering this latest poll.

[mistaTea]

Another week, another poll.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/government-holds-on-in-latest-poll-christopher-luxons-favourability-surges/XNBVRE4KAJHFXBHGIU7CZ3XIEM/

Wonder if Sherman will pounce around like a demented sex deprived dog on heat while covering this latest poll.

Yeah I am waiting for the leading one news story tonight.

NEWS FLASH!!

THE CURRENT GOVERNMENT CAN STILL GOVERN!!

THIS IS GOING TO ABSOLUTELY ROCK PARLIAMENT!

BOOM! WINNIE IS BACK!

[fungus pudding]

Yeah I am waiting for the leading one news story tonight.

NEWS FLASH!!

THE CURRENT GOVERNMENT CAN STILL GOVERN!!

THIS IS GOING TO ABSOLUTELY ROCK PARLIAMENT!

BOOM! WINNIE IS BACK!

Will 'Luxon's popularity surges' get a mention, or an almost inaudible mumble?

[Balance]

Will 'Luxon's popularity surges' get a mention, or an almost inaudible mumble?

Will get no coverage on TV1 as it’s not their poll.

TV3 may mention it 25 minutes into the news bulletin.

[thegreatestben]

Front page on news hub for me currently

[mistaTea]

Front page on news hub for me currently

Leading story on 1news is the new LOTR films.

[tim23]

Will 'Luxon's popularity surges' get a mention, or an almost inaudible mumble?
Popularity and surge are hardly words even you would associate with the PM.

[Balance]

Popularity and surge are hardly words even you would associate with the PM.

Agreed - they are associated with Cindy, the most useless, clueless and hopeless PM ever in the history of NZ.

[Bjauck]

Popularity and surge are hardly words even you would associate with the PM. Sometimes charisma and energy are a good thing for the times; sometimes understated and reflective are too.

[fungus pudding]

Popularity and surge are hardly words even you would associate with the PM.

Not my words

NZ Herald.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/government-holds-on-in-latest-poll-christopher-luxons-favourability-surges/XNBVRE4KAJHFXBHGIU7CZ3XIEM/

[Daytr]

Agreed - they are associated with Cindy, the most useless, clueless and hopeless PM ever in the history of NZ.

Sounds like what JK experienced...

Re the poll, never a good idea to release news on a Friday unless you want it to go unnoticed as much as possible.

[Balance]

Sounds like what JK experienced...

Re the poll, never a good idea to release news on a Friday unless you want it to go unnoticed as much as possible.

Big difference between Clueless Cindy getting kicked out of office (quit before she was fired so she could save her own skin) vs Key leaving on his own terms.

JK took over from Labour after the GFC hit in 2007 (The 2007–2008 financial crisis, or the global financial crisis (GFC), was the most severe worldwide economic crisis since the Great Depression) and steered NZ to become the rock star economy of the 2010s.

And that's after Cullen boasted proudly that he had spent the lot* before Key took office.

Then, there's the Christchurch earthquake.



*https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2008/05/hes_spent_it_all.html

[Balance]

University 0f Woke, BS & Spin

Gone completely woke and now, resorting to and self-indulging in hypocritical false advertising - University of Otago preparing for the ex-Minister of Spin & Prolific Wasteful Spending - Grant Robertson.

Absolutely shameful and despicable that a once great university like University of Otago is resorting to DECEIT - misleading students that it is ranked in the top 1% of universities in the world.

Indicative of what has happened to NZ after 6 years of Clueless Cindy, Hysterical Hipkins and the Labour misfits.

This is the country that the new government is going to have to turn around if our young and brightest are to remain in NZ and not migrate to Australia for their future.

https://www.downtoearth.kiwi/post/what-would-the-advertising-standards-authority-have-to-say-about-otago-university-s-advertising

" ....... take a look at the actual QS world rankings which Otago formally states its ranking is based upon. QS say, "The 20th edition of the QS World University Rankings features 1,500 institutions across 104 locations & is the only ranking of its kind to emphasize employability & sustainability". They rank 1,498 Universities to be precise. QS state that Otago is ranked no. 206 out of those 1,498 institutions, putting it between 10% & 15% in the world ranking, not the "top 1%".

https://www.otago.ac.nz/

[Daytr]

Big difference between Clueless Cindy getting kicked out of office (quit before she was fired so she could save her own skin) vs Key leaving on his own terms.

JK took over from Labour after the GFC hit in 2007 (The 2007–2008 financial crisis, or the global financial crisis (GFC), was the most severe worldwide economic crisis since the Great Depression) and steered NZ to become the rock star economy of the 2010s.

And that's after Cullen boasted proudly that he had spent the lot* before Key took office.

Then, there's the Christchurch earthquake.



*https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2008/05/hes_spent_it_all.html

Key saw the writing on the wall as did Ardern.
Key's popularity had seriously wained towards the end due to things like the flag referendum, ponytailgate & I think ignoring the will of the people and selling of the power companies.
Something we are still paying for today.

Key wouldn't have been able to use the same bully boy tactics against Ardern either as he did against Little.

[Balance]

Key saw the writing on the wall as did Ardern.
Key's popularity had seriously wained towards the end due to things like the flag referendum, ponytailgate & I think ignoring the will of the people and selling of the power companies.
Something we are still paying for today.

Key wouldn't have been able to use the same bully boy tactics against Ardern either as he did against Little.

Do a simple comparison of Key’s & National’s polls rating when he quit vs Ardern’s & Labour’s when Ardern quit.

Then, of what National got by way of votes in 2017 vs Labour in 2023.

The answer is so very obvious as to what the country thought of Clueless Cindy.

Fact is that Cindy was not fit to clean Parliament’s toilets, let alone ran the country.

[mistaTea]

Do a simple comparison of Key’s & National’s polls rating when he quit vs Ardern’s & Labour’s when Ardern quit.

Then, of what National got by way of votes in 2017 vs Labour in 2023.

The answer is so very obvious as to what the country thought of Key vs Clueless Cindy.

Fact is that Cindy was not fit to clean Parliament’s toilets, let alone ran the country.

Hear me, I beg ya.

Beware of Dandelo.

[Daytr]

Do a simple comparison of Key’s & National’s polls rating when he quit vs Ardern’s & Labour’s when Ardern quit.

Then, of what National got by way of votes in 2017 vs Labour in 2023.

The answer is so very obvious as to what the country thought of Clueless Cindy.

Fact is that Cindy was not fit to clean Parliament’s toilets, let alone ran the country.

Yeah fair enough & Ardern was obviously goneski no doubt about that. It would have a close run thing I think for Key especially with Winston not wanting a bar of him.

Here is an interesting cloud diagram on how the attitude to Key had changed from 2011 to 2016. It's pretty much how my attitude changed towards him as well after voting for him in 2008 & 2011.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/23-03-2017/a-statistical-analysis-of-john-keys-legacy

[nztx]

Do a simple comparison of Key’s & National’s polls rating when he quit vs Ardern’s & Labour’s when Ardern quit.

Then, of what National got by way of votes in 2017 vs Labour in 2023.

The answer is so very obvious as to what the country thought of Clueless Cindy.

Fact is that Cindy was not fit to clean Parliament’s toilets, let alone ran the country.


but Robbo was on cleaning duties, wasn't he ? .. Delegated or shoved down the line :)

all that digging, scraping & scratching ... to make the hole bigger ..

[Daytr]

Hear me, I beg ya.

Beware of Dandelo.

Haha nice try buddy. Are you that desperate to shut me up.
Rightly so as I do mostly to you, just ignore what I post.
Trailing me with this repetitive post is all a bit creepy.

[causecelebre]

To the last NZ'er to leave, please turn the lights out

According to the E Stanford half the immigrants arriving are unskilled and low earners and half of those send a good portion of their income back to the home country.

My guess is none of them use roads, schools and hospitals either.....tongue...cheek

https://www.interest.co.nz/economy/127750/influx-238964-migrants-arrived-new-zealand-year-march-stats-nz-also-reporting-record

[Balance]

To the last NZ'er to leave, please turn the lights out

According to the E Stanford half the immigrants arriving are unskilled and low earners and half of those send a good portion of their income back to the home country.

My guess is none of them use roads, schools and hospitals either.....tongue...cheek

https://www.interest.co.nz/economy/127750/influx-238964-migrants-arrived-new-zealand-year-march-stats-nz-also-reporting-record

To the young, brightest and smartest of NZ, leave before this wretched country Aotearoa dims your light and your energy.

Follow those who see the light and know Australia is a far far better country for you & your family.

"The net gain came from an estimated 238,964 long term arrivals, and an estimated 127,818 long term departures from NZ. "

That's the equivalent of the entire population of Hastings and Napier leaving NZ.

[Balance]

Meanwhile, this coalition government cannot even implement the simplest of policy that it promised during the election.

Not only following in the glorious footsteps of Clueless Cindy - all spin and no delivery, but one worse - raining confusion on NZers who voted them into power.

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/national/minister-encourages-doc-to-use-te-reo-maori-everywhere-and-anywhere-despite-government-position/

"The National/New Zealand First coalition agreement states they “require the public service departments and Crown Entities to communicate primarily in English - except those entities specifically related to Māori".

Despite this, departments and agencies have received no official government directive on the use of te reo and English.

No Government entities have been directed to change their names to English."

[Ferg]

No Government entities have been directed to change their names to English."
Perhaps there are bigger fish to fry right now?

[Bjauck]

Perhaps there are bigger fish to fry right now? It is a question of triage priorities. If I need medical help I couldn't care less if I went to hõhipera or hospital. It is the quality of service that is important.

[Bjauck]

To the young, brightest and smartest of NZ, leave before this wretched country Aotearoa dims your light and your energy.

Follow those who see the light and know Australia is a far far better country for you & your family.

"The net gain came from an estimated 238,964 long term arrivals, and an estimated 127,818 long term departures from NZ. "

That's the equivalent of the entire population of Hastings and Napier leaving NZ.
Have you moved to your foreign beach house yet?

[mistaTea]

It is a question of triage priorities. If I need medical help I couldn't care less if I went to hõhipera or hospital. It is the quality of service that is important.

Yeah but once you got to the horihepa you would care very much if they were intermingling te reo with English while explaining your illness and treatment plan!

Primary comms must be in English and the except for agencies specifically set up for Maori.

Govt just hasn’t gotten to it yet. As Ferg says, bigger fish to fry with the massive clean up job needed. This will be further down the priority list.

[Balance]

Have you moved to your foreign beach house yet?

In my own good time, Bjauck - it's there and I visit it every year. I would describe it as being by one of the most beautiful beaches in the world - sheltered crystal clear ocean waters, blessed by beautiful powdery white sand (almost like bigger grain talcum powder) and well provided by all the services (hospitality, entertainment, restaurants, health etc) a person could ever want. Heck, it even has an International School/College which provides students with access to the top universities in the UK & US.

Meanwhile, a net 1,000 NZers (mostly young) leaves Aotearoa permanently (rapidly heading towards 2nd world status) every week, half of them to Australia. Expect this to climb to net 2,000 a week as it becomes clear that Luxon & gang are just as hopeless as the last lot at turning the tide.

FXXK NZ for the divided, directionless, broken and hopeless country it has become.

So let’s congratulate the departing NZers - good on them and they go with the best wishes of all NZers who want a better future for their families.

[Balance]

It is a question of triage priorities. If I need medical help I couldn't care less if I went to hõhipera or hospital. It is the quality of service that is important.

It's politics we are discussing here and Luxon simply does not get the art of politics.

It's the flea or ant in the ear which annoys the patient the most and drive them insane, not the deep wound on the feet.

[Aaron]

To the last NZ'er to leave, please turn the lights out

According to the E Stanford half the immigrants arriving are unskilled and low earners and half of those send a good portion of their income back to the home country.

My guess is none of them use roads, schools and hospitals either.....tongue...cheek

https://www.interest.co.nz/economy/127750/influx-238964-migrants-arrived-new-zealand-year-march-stats-nz-also-reporting-record

Same under National or Labour or National again. What is the plan? Stop investing in future generations until they see no way to afford a house an education and a family and are forced overseas. So our best and brightest are heading overseas to be replaced with unskilled labour from the third world.

I guess with social mobility being destroyed by monetary and tax policy the immigrants won't be a threat to the privileged position of the older wealthier generation, more like low paid servants to ensure a comfortable retirement.

A lot of policy seems to be focused on ensuring a comfortable retirement for boomers at the expense of the next generation. (Capital gains tax, untested superannuation entitlement etc)

If it turns NZ into a low wage, third world, overcrowded s*ithole country who cares, we will probably be dead before it is a problem. (Typical boomer response.)

Once all the immigrants get a NZ visa they will be off to Aussie as well, unless Aussie closes the door again as NZ becomes a backdoor into Aussie again.

Then you get dheads like this who think a stable or falling population is a bad thing or a crisis. They also probably support inflation targeting and other ridiculous notions.

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/a-shrinking-country-kiwis-warned-to-prepare-for-population-crisis-learn-from-japan-s-mistakes/ar-BB1mlNYs?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=312d2991de0443b1a697946eb3a32104&ei=13

The line near the top of the article really summarises why it is considered a crisis.

"Yuri Suzuki is worried about who will care for the baby boomer generations as they age and need more care. "

I think that sentence explains the main concern and reason for out of control immigration of low skilled labour from the third world to NZ and its political acceptability.

The article goes on to talk about how there will be less Japanese people buying and consuming and no tenants for the owners of real estate.

Fortunately we have Massey University Emeritus Professor Paul Spoonley from NZ to tell Japan what it is doing wrong. I thought he must have been a professor of economics but it turns out he is a sociologist. Another BA degree based on waffle, probably as bad as an economist.

But what Professor Spoonley recommends is uncontrolled immigration like we have here in NZ.

No thought of a stable or sustainable population, growth and inflation all the way.

He probably has the gall to suggest he is concerned about climate change.

[mistaTea]

Summary of what to expect at the end of this month.

****

The New Zealand government is set to announce tax cuts at the end of May, focusing primarily on providing relief to low- and middle-income earners. The coalition government, led by Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Finance Minister Nicola Willis, has emphasized that the tax cuts will be funded through reprioritized spending, savings, and new revenue sources, rather than borrowing [oai_citation:1,Budget Policy Statement: Willis promises cuts despite late return to surplus | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/512805/budget-policy-statement-willis-promises-cuts-despite-late-return-to-surplus) [oai_citation:2,First steps for tax and income relief announced | Beehive.govt.nz](https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/first-steps-tax-and-income-relief-announced) [oai_citation:3,Willis vows to press on with tax cuts as government books worsen | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/505168/willis-vows-to-press-on-with-tax-cuts-as-government-books-worsen).

Key elements of the upcoming tax cuts include:

1. **Income Tax Relief**: The government plans to introduce meaningful income tax reductions aimed at the "squeezed middle" of New Zealanders who have not seen tax relief in many years. This is expected to be the centerpiece of the budget [oai_citation:4,Budget Policy Statement: Willis promises cuts despite late return to surplus | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/512805/budget-policy-statement-willis-promises-cuts-despite-late-return-to-surplus).

2. **Family Boost Childcare Tax Rebate**: The coalition is considering the implementation of a new tax rebate to help with childcare costs, which is part of their broader income relief measures [oai_citation:5,First steps for tax and income relief announced | Beehive.govt.nz](https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/first-steps-tax-and-income-relief-announced) [oai_citation:6,Willis vows to press on with tax cuts as government books worsen | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/505168/willis-vows-to-press-on-with-tax-cuts-as-government-books-worsen).

3. **Property Tax Changes**: The bright-line test for residential property will be reduced to two years starting from July 1, 2024. Additionally, the government will restore interest deductibility for rental properties, reversing previous policies [oai_citation:7,First steps for tax and income relief announced | Beehive.govt.nz](https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/first-steps-tax-and-income-relief-announced).

4. **Funding and Savings**: To afford these tax cuts, the government has identified significant savings by halting several projects and policies initiated by the previous government, such as Let's Get Wellington Moving and the extension of free childcare. These measures are intended to ensure that the tax cuts do not exacerbate inflationary pressures or require additional borrowing [oai_citation:8,Budget Policy Statement: Willis promises cuts despite late return to surplus | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/512805/budget-policy-statement-willis-promises-cuts-despite-late-return-to-surplus) [oai_citation:9,Willis vows to press on with tax cuts as government books worsen | RNZ News](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/505168/willis-vows-to-press-on-with-tax-cuts-as-government-books-worsen).

While the exact details will be unveiled with the budget, these steps outline the government's approach to providing tax relief while maintaining fiscal prudence. The focus remains on delivering targeted support to those most affected by recent economic challenges.

[nztx]

Nice to see Middle Income sector of the spectrum being recognised now.

This section of the tax base has been repeatedly ignored by successive Governments
in the past and left wearing a significant portion of the economic onslaught / damage
while bracket creep adjustment lagged with earnings growth occurring continued north

Lets see whether Dividend Withholding tax levels are adjusted or new formula put in play
against the static 33% dividend tax heist (aggregate of imputation tax with excess ripped
out of the cash dividend) A reduction so fully imputed means no DWT wouldn't go amiss
and align with current 28% Company tax rates.

[nztx]

More Potholes @ the Waka of Roading incompetence come to light:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/waka-kotahi-pays-pwc-to-meld-together-technologies-then-again-to-pull-them-apart/BLGRQ2R4HNEZFIPNZJ72R4QOSI/

Waka Kotahi pays PWC to meld together technologies, then again to pull them apart



NZ Transport Agency Waka Kotahi (NZTA) paid consultants PWC to try to meld together its two new vehicle-spotting technologies, only to have to pull them back apart, documents show.

NZTA wanted to see if it could use the same tech platform for both highway safety speed cameras and tolls, and save money, on a total spend worth over $130 million.

But it found out it couldn’t - and the uncertainty has only grown since around the tolling system’s design, which has had to be added to multiple times since NZTA was awarded the tender two years ago.


Nice to see the local long hairy arm of PWC Beancounter Advisory have been busy, but did they manage to show TW of RI what a large pothole looks like & how it should be fixed ? ;)

130 big one$ would go a way to making a hole in the Lost Cause - Labour's large & multiplying collection of pot holes around the country

[Bjauck]

In my own good time, Bjauck - it's there and I visit it every year. I would describe it as being by one of the most beautiful beaches in the world - sheltered crystal clear ocean waters, blessed by beautiful powdery white sand (almost like bigger grain talcum powder) and well provided by all the services (hospitality, entertainment, restaurants, health etc) a person could ever want. Heck, it even has an International School/College which provides students with access to the top universities in the UK & US.

Meanwhile, a net 1,000 NZers (mostly young) leaves Aotearoa permanently (rapidly heading towards 2nd world status) every week, half of them to Australia. Expect this to climb to net 2,000 a week as it becomes clear that Luxon & gang are just as hopeless as the last lot at turning the tide.

FXXK NZ for the divided, directionless, broken and hopeless country it has become.

So let’s congratulate the departing NZers - good on them and they go with the best wishes of all NZers who want a better future for their families. Since you think NZ is a basket case, What is stopping you from quitting NZ pronto for your holiday home? In the country where your holiday home is, what is life like for those who cannot send their children to the "international school"?

[Bjauck]

Yeah but once you got to the horihepa you would care very much if they were intermingling te reo with English while explaining your illness and treatment plan!

Primary comms must be in English and the except for agencies specifically set up for Maori.

Govt just hasn’t gotten to it yet. As Ferg says, bigger fish to fry with the massive clean up job needed. This will be further down the priority list. It was the use of the Te Reo in the branding of agencies that we were discussing. However I agree that clear communication is important. Unfortunately I have extensive experience of dealing with hospitals and the scenario you suggest has never arisen. Indeed there are translation services for those whose first language is not English so that communication with medical staff is as clear as possible.

[Balance]

Since you think NZ is a basket case, What is stopping you from quitting NZ pronto for your holiday home? In the country where your holiday home is, what is life like for those who cannot send their children to the "international school"?

Life is good there.

They don’t breed parasites, beneficiaries, losers and lawless thugs like in Aotearoa.

They also don’t have state agencies like Kainga Ora breeding anti-social tenants who terrorise neighbours with impunity. And they sure as hell don’t have politicians spinning BS while wastefully squandering tens of billions of dollars delivering nothing!

[Bjauck]

Life is good there.

They don’t breed parasites, beneficiaries, losers and lawless thugs like in Aotearoa.

They also don’t have state agencies like Kainga Ora breeding anti-social tenants who terrorise neighbours with impunity. And they sure as hell don’t have politicians spinning BS while wastefully squandering tens of billions of dollars delivering nothing!
So in which country is your tropical beach paradise with an “international” school? Why don’t you leave miserable NZ now?

[davflaws]

Life is good there.

They don’t breed parasites, beneficiaries, losers and lawless thugs like in Aotearoa.

They also don’t have state agencies like Kainga Ora breeding anti-social tenants who terrorise neighbours with impunity. And they sure as hell don’t have politicians spinning BS while wastefully squandering tens of billions of dollars delivering nothing!

The Whitsundays are calling. You should relocate immediately and get away from the awful people here. Leave the parasites, losers, and lawless thugs and go.

The people over the ditch will appreciate your warmth, caring and sympathy for those less able and fortunate. They will enjoy your tolerance of other views and your ability and readiness to engage in rational debate.

I'm sure you will find it easy to make friends there and you will be able to live out your remaining days with warm and close human relationships while enjoying the spectacle as this sh!thole country and all the poor deluded souls in it sink further into the swamp of woke socialism.

[Daytr]

It's politics we are discussing here and Luxon simply does not get the art of politics.

It's the flea or ant in the ear which annoys the patient the most and drive them insane, not the deep wound on the feet.

I would suggest the exact opposite.
Luxon knows he can't lose the more reasonable middle ground, the swing voters that decide elections.
The centrist doesn't have the extreme views of the likes of NZF or ACT, they are voters who will drop National if they become too extreme, underperform or other, they are fickle & its for these same sort of reasons they dropped Labour & elected the coalition.

[Balance]

So in which country is your tropical beach paradise with an “international” school? Why don’t you leave miserable NZ now?

In my own good time and on my terms.

And are you seriously unaware of international schools operated by highly reputable and respected educational establishments in cities/countries where there are large expat communities? So their children can receive world class education to go to top colleges and universities in the West? Obviously not University of Otago or wtf they call themselves these days and falsely claim that they are rated in the top 1% of universities in the world.

https://www.international-schools-database.com/in/da-nang

https://www.international-schools-database.com/in/singapore

[Bjauck]

In my own good time and on my terms.

And are you seriously unaware of international schools operated by highly reputable and respected educational establishments in cities/countries where there are large expat communities? So their children can receive world class education to go to top colleges and universities in the West? Obviously not University of Otago or wtf they call themselves these days and falsely claim that they are rated in the top 1% of universities in the world.

https://www.international-schools-database.com/in/da-nang

https://www.international-schools-database.com/in/singapore Sure international schools and access to the top universities comes at a cost. I am aware. So your tropical beach paradise is in Vietnam. In international comparisons of measure of quality of life, political corruption etc., NZ scores far in excess of Vietnam. However kudos for being wealthy enough to have a second home in a tropical beach paradise and have access to services that most of the local population cannot afford. You can choose whichever location pleases you at the time.

There is much that can be improved in NZ. While not necessarily agreeing with all their policies, I appreciate that NZF and ACT really do want improvements and the best for NZ. Unfortunately your recent comments do not lend to themselves to the same conclusion.

[Balance]

I would suggest the exact opposite.
Luxon knows he can't lose the more reasonable middle ground, the swing voters that decide elections.
The centrist doesn't have the extreme views of the likes of NZF or ACT, they are voters who will drop National if they become too extreme, underperform or other, they are fickle & its for these same sort of reasons they dropped Labour & elected the coalition.

Watch what happens next election if Luxon continues along the current spineless track.

ACT & NZF will take more of the traditional National votes and leave National in a weakened position.

Good example of the public mood :

https://thebfd.co.nz/2024/05/16/new-poll-flushes-opponents-to-winstons-bill-down-the-dunny/

" ...... Winston’s no weirdos in women’s bathrooms bill. The Labour Party are all in on opposing this and I suggested that they should go for it, that Winston had the right of it. It turns out Winston and I were right.

Family First commissioned a poll to see what the public thinks and, what do you know, Kiwis think the same as Winston."

[Daytr]

Watch what happens next election if Luxon continues along the current spineless track.

ACT & NZF will take more of the traditional National votes and leave National in a weakened position.

Good example of the public mood :

https://thebfd.co.nz/2024/05/16/new-poll-flushes-opponents-to-winstons-bill-down-the-dunny/

" ...... Winston’s no weirdos in women’s bathrooms bill. The Labour Party are all in on opposing this and I suggested that they should go for it, that Winston had the right of it. It turns out Winston and I were right.

Family First commissioned a poll to see what the public thinks and, what do you know, Kiwis think the same as Winston."


NZF & ACT have lost more support than any other party since the election I believe. Happy to stand corrected. If you think more people are going to swing harder right, I think you are mistaken.

Elections are still won in the middle ground, that 20% swing voter. I think you will find voters wanted a rebalance not a full swing of the pendulum.

[Aaron]

Watch what happens next election if Luxon continues along the current spineless track.

ACT & NZF will take more of the traditional National votes and leave National in a weakened position.

Good example of the public mood :

https://thebfd.co.nz/2024/05/16/new-poll-flushes-opponents-to-winstons-bill-down-the-dunny/

" ...... Winston’s no weirdos in women’s bathrooms bill. The Labour Party are all in on opposing this and I suggested that they should go for it, that Winston had the right of it. It turns out Winston and I were right.

Family First commissioned a poll to see what the public thinks and, what do you know, Kiwis think the same as Winston."


Funnily enough I was reading an article in the herald this morning about a person who was upset working for Taika Waititi. The person goes by They/Them and suffered abuse and a back injury and PTSD apparently.

The article initially sounded as though it was lots of people, until you realised they were talking about one whiny idiot. It makes you wonder why the herald would pander to these *ucktards.

[Daytr]

Kudos to the coalition for banning phones in schools. Anecdotal feedback I have heard as follows.

One kid not bothering to take their phone to school at all. Why? Because phones are no longer cool.

Heaps more kids now running around and playing at lunchtime. Being far more active and interacting more with each other.

This could be one of the most significant policy changes that this Government makes and its positive impact could be far reaching.

[Bjauck]

Funnily enough I was reading an article in the herald this morning about a person who was upset working for Taika Waititi. The person goes by They/Them and suffered abuse and a back injury and PTSD apparently.

The article initially sounded as though it was lots of people, until you realised they were talking about one whiny idiot. It makes you wonder why the herald would pander to these *ucktards.
Surely the important issue is the alleged trauma and abuse, not the gender of the person, and whether the Herald knew the gender, or asked how the person wanted to be identified.

[Balance]

Funnily enough I was reading an article in the herald this morning about a person who was upset working for Taika Waititi. The person goes by They/Them and suffered abuse and a back injury and PTSD apparently.

The article initially sounded as though it was lots of people, until you realised they were talking about one whiny idiot. It makes you wonder why the herald would pander to these *ucktards.

All in the name of Wokeism.

The Herald and MSM prefer to butcher the English language and grammar rather than use a more suitable way of describing an individual - could be he, she, it or "name' when it is but an individual. Instead they use 'they'.

Fxxk the whole lot of them.

[causecelebre]

Surely the important issue is the alleged trauma and abuse, not the gender of the person, and whether the Herald knew the gender, or asked how the person wanted to be identified.

"She" wanted to use the "they" pronoun, not the Herald making the decision. Bloody confusing when reading the article. Makes it sound like a whole bunch of them were effected (or should that be affected haha)

[mistaTea]

Funnily enough I was reading an article in the herald this morning about a person who was upset working for Taika Waititi. The person goes by They/Them and suffered abuse and a back injury and PTSD apparently.

The article initially sounded as though it was lots of people, until you realised they were talking about one whiny idiot. It makes you wonder why the herald would pander to these *ucktards.

Yeah it is pretty bad, and just another example of the woke MSM thinking they know best and attempting to ram stuff down our throats.

And yet they still cannot understand why a lot of people don't want to use their platform as a source of news anymore.

[mistaTea]

"She" wanted to use the "they" pronoun, not the Herald making the decision. Bloody confusing when reading the article. Makes it sound like a whole bunch of them were effected (or should that be affected haha)

They (as in The Herald, i.e. correct use of the term) could have just used her name each time to be clear if they didn't want to 'offend' with a he or she pronoun.

But The Herald are too busy showing how awesome and inclusive they are.

To their detriment ultimately.

[Aaron]

Surely the important issue is the alleged trauma and abuse, not the gender of the person, and whether the Herald knew the gender, or asked how the person wanted to be identified.

To be honest I could not give a s*it about the persons trauma even if they were a he, a she or a they. I was just annoyed that I thought I was reading about large scale abuse on a movie set until I realised they were talking about one possibly troubled individual who was unhappy.

It annoys me that people want to use "they" and "them" instead of "he" and "she" as it makes things confusing and IMO should not be encouraged by main stream media as I would assume clarity when writing would be important for a real journalist.

[davflaws]

Have you moved to your foreign beach house yet?
I am wondering whether Balance's 'tropical paradise' exists anywhere but his imagination. The first link he posted referred to the Whitsundays, but the second one indicated Vietnam. Which is it?

[mistaTea]

To be honest I could not give a s*it about the persons trauma even if they were a he, a she or a they. I was just annoyed that I thought I was reading about large scale abuse on a movie set until I realised they were talking about one possibly troubled individual who was unhappy.

It annoys me that people want to use "they" and "them" instead of "he" and "she" as it makes things confusing and IMO should not be encouraged by main stream media as I would assume clarity when writing would be important for a real journalist.

Agreed, I can go along with calling a male to female trans she (or vice versa) but when they try to come up with all of this other sh1te that is confusing I am less than impressed too.

You see it on Linkedin a lot now too where the majority who are not even trans are adding their preferred pronound. WTF.

We have a bloke at work who likes to wear dresses. I don't actually know if 'she' is a transgender or if he is just a transvestite. Lovely bloke/lady I am sure... but to be honest I just try to avoid because I just know I am going to say 'the wrong thing' or put my foot in it somehow and then look like a bigot.

I doubt I am alone in feeling that way. And I am actually all for people expressing themselves how they want to etc...but it just feels like a political minefield now.

[fungus pudding]

It annoys me that people want to use "they" and "them" instead of "he" and "she" as it makes things confusing and IMO should not be encouraged by main stream media as I would assume clarity when writing would be important for a real journalist.

Hear hear - you and me both.

[mistaTea]

Iwi will only communicate in te reo (https://newsroom.co.nz/2024/05/17/iwi-pledges-to-use-only-te-reo-maori-to-communicate-with-govt/#:~:text=The%20move%20comes%20after%20the,te%20reo %20lessons%20for%20staff)

A few thoughts.

1. Certainly in terms of written comms, AI now means that this form of protest is redundant. A Minister can have the comms translated in seconds.
2. AI can even help with spoken translation. Just yesterday I was playing around with CHATGPT-4o... I was chatting away in English and then suddenly switched languages. I was impressed at how it understood both English (with all my umming and arring) as well as my heavily NZ-accented Hindi. This tech is a game changer and will mean people can speak to you in whatever language and you can have your own personal translator in your pocket.
3. I understand that Iwi are not happy about the govt looking to reverse Maori names for Ministries etc, but ultimately they need to consider whether doing things like this which potentially add barries to communication and increase the odds of misunderstanding is in their best long term interests.

[Bjauck]

To be honest I could not give a s*it about the persons trauma even if they were a he, a she or a they. I was just annoyed that I thought I was reading about large scale abuse on a movie set until I realised they were talking about one possibly troubled individual who was unhappy.

It annoys me that people want to use "they" and "them" instead of "he" and "she" as it makes things confusing and IMO should not be encouraged by main stream media as I would assume clarity when writing would be important for a real journalist.
I often hear “they” used when the speaker is unsure whether there is a “he” or “she”. Using “it” would be distractingly rude and inappropriate.

I haven’t been able to find and read the article in question, so do not know how confusing “they” was in context.

[causecelebre]

Agreed, I can go along with calling a male to female trans she (or vice versa) but when they try to come up with all of this other sh1te that is confusing I am less than impressed too.

You see it on Linkedin a lot now too where the majority who are not even trans are adding their preferred pronound. WTF.

We have a bloke at work who likes to wear dresses. I don't actually know if 'she' is a transgender or if he is just a transvestite. Lovely bloke/lady I am sure... but to be honest I just try to avoid because I just know I am going to say 'the wrong thing' or put my foot in it somehow and then look like a bigot.

I doubt I am alone in feeling that way. And I am actually all for people expressing themselves how they want to etc...but it just feels like a political minefield now.

I feel like this in life now. I was in the office the other day. My neighbour just started ranting about Trump, Elon Musk and various other progressive "issues". Now, if I was to take the other side it would be career risk. I feel like I have to walk through life keeping my mouth closed. Its a form of oppression and pushes me further away from appreciating the point of view from the "other side".

Can't imagine what would happen if I went to HR an said I didn't feel "safe"

[causecelebre]

Iwi will only communicate in te reo (https://newsroom.co.nz/2024/05/17/iwi-pledges-to-use-only-te-reo-maori-to-communicate-with-govt/#:~:text=The%20move%20comes%20after%20the,te%20reo %20lessons%20for%20staff)

A few thoughts.

1. Certainly in terms of written comms, AI now means that this form of protest is redundant. A Minister can have the comms translated in seconds.
2. AI can even help with spoken translation. Just yesterday I was playing around with CHATGPT-4o... I was chatting away in English and then suddenly switched languages. I was impressed at how it understood both English (with all my umming and arring) as well as my heavily NZ-accented Hindi. This tech is a game changer and will mean people can speak to you in whatever language and you can have your own personal translator in your pocket.
3. I understand that Iwi are not happy about the govt looking to reverse Maori names for Ministries etc, but ultimately they need to consider whether doing things like this which potentially add barries to communication and increase the odds of misunderstanding is in their best long term interests.

I was talking about this to Mrs Causecelebre the other day. I can imagine very soon wearing my head phones and having direct translation when conversing with another language speaker in real time

[mistaTea]

I feel like this in life now. I was in the office the other day. My neighbour just started ranting about Trump, Elon Musk and various other progressive "issues". Now, if I was to take the other side it would be career risk. I feel like I have to walk through life keeping my mouth closed. Its a form of oppression and pushes me further away from appreciating the point of view from the "other side".

Can't imagine what would happen if I went to HR an said I didn't feel "safe"

Totally, in the work place if you have opinions that are not part of the accepted script it is better to just keep your mouth shut as you cannot predict how your career could be negatively impacted.

Speaking ones mind then become the domain of the rich who do not need to work, but even that is fraught with difficulty.

[Bjauck]

I am wondering whether Balance's 'tropical paradise' exists anywhere but his imagination. The first link he posted referred to the Whitsundays, but the second one indicated Vietnam. Which is it? Ok I missed that link. I have looked for an “International School” in the Whitsundays - just found links to English language schools, and an Anglican School which caters for international students. It sounds pretty Aussie and seems part of the Australian education system. Anyway Auckland schools also carry the Bacc and Cambridge exams and cater for international students.

[causecelebre]

Totally, in the work place if you have opinions that are not part of the accepted script it is better to just keep your mouth shut as you cannot predict how your career could be negatively impacted.

Speaking ones mind then become the domain of the rich who do not need to work, but even that is fraught with difficulty.

And the domain of the progressives. They unwaveringly believe they have the moral high ground and anyone that doesn't subscribe to their way of thinking are oppressors and should be cancelled

[Bjauck]

I was talking about this to Mrs Causecelebre the other day. I can imagine very soon wearing my head phones and having direct translation when conversing with another language speaker in real time
I don’t think Mrs C would appreciate that when she is trying to talk to you..:p

[Aaron]

I often hear “they” used when the speaker is unsure whether there is a “he” or “she”. Using “it” would be distractingly rude and inappropriate.

I haven’t been able to find and read the article in question, so do not know how confusing “they” was in context.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/charlyne-yi-claims-physical-abuse-on-set-of-taika-waititi-tv-series-time-bandits/TOFNEXT7ZRA3DKZGVLYXXPZPOU/

If you are not a herald subscriber here is the opening lines.

American actor Charlyne Yi has claimed they were assaulted and psychologically abused on the set of Taika Waititi and Jemaine Clement’s upcoming Apple TV+ series.

Yi - who uses they/them pronouns - made the allegations on Instagram, where they claimed they were forced to quit the series, Time Bandits, which was filmed in New Zealand in 2022 and 2023.

They claimed they were then denied compensation for their alleged injuries, which included a back injury and PTSD.

Without naming anyone specific, Yi claimed they were told they were able to leave the show if they wanted to.

They also alleged they were “gaslit by coworkers, producers and HR” and were told that by submitting to the unnamed alleged abuser, who is understood to be a male, they wouldn’t be physically assaulted any further.

Probably not that hard to understand with the explanation at the top, but really is this necessary. Take away the explanation "Yi - who uses they/them pronouns - made the allegations on Instagram, where they claimed they were forced to quit the series" and the article makes a mountain out of a molehill.

The fact she uses social media to address her problems, says a lot about her IMO.

Oops how insensitive I should have said.

The fact they use social media to address their problems, says a lot about them IMO. I hope that clarifies and assists with the understanding of my previous statement.

Not a biggie, just f*cking annoying as I am sure Charlyne is, perhaps that is why she was gaslit by coworkers, producers and HR (basically everyone on the movie set).

Writing on social media to explain to everyone your a *unt is probably not wise although in a brief moment of self-awareness I realise that is advice I should also follow.

[causecelebre]

Writing on social media to explain to everyone your a *unt is probably not wise although in a brief moment of self-awareness I realise that is advice I should also follow.


Comment of the month.

[Bjauck]

Thanks Aaron. It seems clear to me that there was just the one person involved. I agree that making the allegations on instagram initially was ridiculous, They should have used the employment grievance process. The gender statement about Charlyne would get conservative backs up straight away! Was it necessary? The item could have been reworded to make it less about gender issues.

[davflaws]

Thanks Aaron. It seems clear to me that there was just the one person involved. I agree that making the allegations on instagram initially was ridiculous, They should have used the employment grievance process. The gender statement about Charlyne would get conservative backs up straight away! Was it necessary? The item could have been reworded to make it less about gender issues.
I am now well retired from any employment advocacy, but I'm not sure that the Personal Grievance processes are available to people working in the film industry.

Key introduced legislation at Peter Jackson's insistance for the LOTR movies so they could make all workers 'contractors' and treat them pretty much any way they wanted. I suspect that legislation is still in force.

[Bjauck]

I am now well retired from any employment advocacy, but I'm not sure that the Personal Grievance processes are available to people working in the film industry.

Key introduced legislation at Peter Jackson's insistance for the LOTR movies so they could make all workers 'contractors' and treat them pretty much any way they wanted. I suspect that legislation is still in force.Good point. I knew Peter Jackson used LOTR money to get the change. I thought Labour had changed the law again, but don't actually know. I know many companies in NZ use "independent" contractors where previously they had employees. In that case Charlyne should go for it; they should speak their truth to power.

Would the alleged behaviour Charlyne experienced be such to frustrate or impeded the performance of their contract? I guess it depends on the terms. The Human Rights Act 1993 covers contractors as well.

[Joshuatree]

As I expected a trend is starting to develop
NZ politics live: Left bloc outpaces right bloc in new political poll ,Stuff.

[Panda-NZ-]

The 13 bucks a week should cheer people up.

Don't spend it all at once. ;)

[nztx]

The 13 bucks a week should cheer people up.

Don't spend it all at once. ;)


A multiple of Labour's single lonely COL effort or not - before the state of his Economy creation frightened him ? ;)


Beats all Labour's Cost of Living beat ups, Fuel Tax Hike Ups & Extra Tax heists and quick patch up hands out to cover all their other massive c*ck-^ps - Cuz ;)

[Joshuatree]

As I expected a trend is starting to develop
NZ politics live: Left bloc outpaces right bloc in new political poll ,Stuff.
This Cannibal Govts slash and burn tactics are soout of our times it's incredulous.
I'm looking forward to something a little more wrap around and nurture ,and environmental valuation.The rest will look after itself,when this Cannibal Collective eats itself.

[nztx]

This Cannibal Govts slash and burn tactics are soout of our times it's incredulous.
I'm looking forward to something a little more wrap around and nurture ,and environmental valuation.The rest will look after itself,when this Cannibal Collective eats itself.


Just as well Lab/Greens didn't continue .. Robbo might have fallen in & buried himself in one of his large Holes ,
Parker would be forced to invent some hair brained scheme to tax fresh air and Chippie would be so running out
of clown tricks that they would be all reruns .. The front bench would be getting so scarce on talent that
cardboard cut-outs would be having to be trotted out to try to bluff the gullable on claims that no further
talent had been knifed, kicked out or thrown overboard during Chippy's sausage roll making run ;)

[jonu]

This Cannibal Govts slash and burn tactics are soout of our times it's incredulous.
I'm looking forward to something a little more wrap around and nurture ,and environmental valuation.The rest will look after itself,when this Cannibal Collective eats itself.

Do you mean like Cindy's wellbeing budgets? They worked out well...not. The pain everyone is currently feeling and will be for some time to come, rests on the pack of useless sods from 2020-23. Unfortunately, I fear our grandchildren will still be paying for it. I most certainly did not vote for the incompetent pack of destroyers and find fewer and fewer who admit they did.

And BTW JT, what was it that Hosking had wrong about the Greens?

[Baa_Baa]

This Cannibal Govts slash and burn tactics are soout of our times it's incredulous.
I'm looking forward to something a little more wrap around and nurture ,and environmental valuation.The rest will look after itself,when this Cannibal Collective eats itself.

Straight from the hypocrite who preys on other investors advice here, has never come up with a good investment idea themself, and has a concerted focus on investing/speculating on companies that are environmentally destructive plundering natural resources.

Back to your gins and pot, hypocrite.

[Panda-NZ-]

Straight from the hypocrite who preys on other investors advice here, has never come up with a good investment idea themself, and has a concerted focus on investing/speculating on companies that are environmentally destructive plundering natural resources.

Back to your gins and pot, hypocrite.

Plenty of that incoming, all for 6 bucks/kg raw milk powder and natural resources plundered from NZ by a tax avoiding international enterprise.

[Bjauck]

Straight from the hypocrite who preys on other investors advice here, has never come up with a good investment idea themself, and has a concerted focus on investing/speculating on companies that are environmentally destructive plundering natural resources.

Back to your gins and pot, hypocrite.
Aren’t the freely made and shared posts actually opinions with an implicit DYOR, or pay a professional to do it, and definitely not investment advice. So there is no preying and no obligation to post “ideas”.

[mistaTea]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/labour-leader-chris-hipkins-unveils-his-vision-for-the-party-through-to-2040/U4KZEFWYKBGSHKPDUKBJID5N3M/

More big talk and **** **** from Labour.

They couldn’t even deliver any of the last round of bullsh1t that they promised.

Who in their right mind would believe any of the absolute sh1te they dream up now?

If they snivel back in it will just be more mess for National to clean up later.

Let’s hope voters see through the spin on a couple of years time. I think National need a couple of terms at least to see what they can do.

First term will mostly be clean up and stabilisation.

[Panda-NZ-]

They need to put us back on track, eh.

Except they can't say where the train is going.. hence voters losing confidence in them.

[nztx]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/labour-leader-chris-hipkins-unveils-his-vision-for-the-party-through-to-2040/U4KZEFWYKBGSHKPDUKBJID5N3M/

More big talk and **** **** from Labour.

They couldn’t even deliver any of the last round of bullsh1t that they promised.

Who in their right mind would believe any of the absolute sh1te they dream up now?

If they snivel back in it will just be more mess for National to clean up later.

Let’s hope voters see through the spin on a couple of years time. I think National need a couple of terms at least to see what they can do.

First term will mostly be clean up and stabilisation.



Chris Hipkins has told Labour members at an Auckland conference he envisages the party getting back into power in two years and then spending a decade building a strong economy



Labour, Labour with Robbo as Finance Spinner, Labour with Hipkins as Head Honcho dreamer have well and truly proven they can't build pussy and never will until they grow a pair and chop away the characteristic clouds of Pink BS ;)

and that only likely a very long way off with Hipkins well and truly gone ;)

The Kiwi Voters are not stupid to the spinning BS Artists who produced very little in the most recent 6 years
and it will probably take a long time before they get f-Witted again by the clueless bunch of Labour / Green wannebie triers promising every under the sun .. achieve nothing ;)

[Balance]

Australia noticing the tens of thousands of NZers (mostly young and skilled) leaving Aotearoa with half of them migrating to Australia.

Watch the flow become a tsunami when the unemployment numbers (engineered by buffoon Adrian Orr & Hysterical Hapless Hipkins/Clueless Cindy) go above 5%.

And good luck & best wishes to each and everyone of them - they go with the goodwill of all NZers who are objective and know that NZ is heading towards 2nd world status rapidly.

Why should they & their children carry the burden of the tens of billions of dollars of debt built up by Ardern & Robertson with NOTHING to show but more beneficiaries, parasites, losers and criminals.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-18/nz-unemployment-high-kiwis-coming-to-australia/103791070

[Getty]

Is Jack Tame a saboteur to NZ's economy?

Why would he put such a repeated effort in this mornings Q&A, to try to get Todd McClay, Trade Minister, to make negative comments and judgements against our trading partners?

Disgraceful!

What is his motivation on state funded broadcasting to commit such treachery?

Fortunately for NZ, McClay weathered the storm.

[winner69]

Australia noticing the tens of thousands of NZers (mostly young and skilled) leaving Aotearoa with half of them migrating to Australia.

Watch the flow become a tsunami when the unemployment numbers (engineered by buffoon Adrian Orr & Hysterical Hapless Hipkins/Clueless Cindy) go above 5%.

And good luck & best wishes to each and everyone of them - they go with the goodwill of all NZers who are objective and know that NZ is heading towards 2nd world status rapidly.

Why should they & their children carry the burden of the tens of billions of dollars of debt built up by Ardern & Robertson with NOTHING to show but more beneficiaries, parasites, losers and criminals.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-18/nz-unemployment-high-kiwis-coming-to-australia/103791070

Guy from Westpac agrees with you ….as NZ unemployment rate increases faster than in Aussie the differential as per dark line will increasecand green line being net Kiwis leaving will also increase

[Daytr]

Is Jack Tame a saboteur to NZ's economy?

Why would he put such a repeated effort in this mornings Q&A, to try to get Todd McClay, Trade Minister, to make negative comments and judgements against our trading partners?

Disgraceful!

What is his motivation on state funded broadcasting to commit such treachery?

Fortunately for NZ, McClay weathered the storm.

I didn't think there was anything wrong with the interview.
Treachery 🤣 Tame's job is to ask tough questions and he did, he could've really got stuck in regarding sheepgate.
McClay handled himself well & it was a good robust interview, but perhaps you think the media should go soft on the Government,

[mistaTea]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/christopher-luxon-compares-labour-to-arsonists-in-firery-speech/JNHP4SVLIFBD7LAMZILHVMW5GQ/

Luxon said that Labour’s questions to him each sitting week “was a bit like an arsonist returning to the scene of a fire that they started and then criticising the fire brigade for the means by which it is extinguishing the fire.

“It’s a surreal experience to go through, I’ve got to be honest,” with you,” he said.

[Aaron]

Australia noticing the tens of thousands of NZers (mostly young and skilled) leaving Aotearoa with half of them migrating to Australia.

Watch the flow become a tsunami when the unemployment numbers (engineered by buffoon Adrian Orr & Hysterical Hapless Hipkins/Clueless Cindy) go above 5%.

And good luck & best wishes to each and everyone of them - they go with the goodwill of all NZers who are objective and know that NZ is heading towards 2nd world status rapidly.

Why should they & their children carry the burden of the tens of billions of dollars of debt built up by Ardern & Robertson with NOTHING to show but more beneficiaries, parasites, losers and criminals.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-18/nz-unemployment-high-kiwis-coming-to-australia/103791070

But what is the solution?
Fran O'Sullivan reckons

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/fran-osullivan-column-bugger-the-politics-lets-get-rational-and-sort-our-economy/IS5NMUNV45HDBEAE6VVFYNA344/

New Zealand surely doesn’t need to drown in a tsunami of debt and post-Budget deficits into the future when it can raise funds from selling shareholdings in prime assets, restrain new spending and tax capital gains.

Steven Joyce has a different view

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/steven-joyce-column-the-case-for-tax-cuts-lets-give-kiwis-some-hope/ZINO3IRWRFEFBOW4N5YW26GERQ/

To achieve economic growth, we need to increase the rewards for working an hour, for investing another dollar or hiring another worker. We won’t do that by simply declaring higher nominal wage rates for everyone which are eaten up by inflation, or by slugging people with higher and higher marginal tax rates. We do it by letting them keep more of the money they earn.

Liam Dann throws in his 2cents worth.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/record-migrations-why-thousands-are-ditching-new-zealand-for-australia/OG5P5P33VFAJ5NHQI3IPGCGU2Y/

Dann said superannuation and CGT are some of the key factors in why New Zealand is “languishing” compared to our transtasman neighbours.

“For me, there are two key things Australia has that we don’t. Compulsory superannuation savings and a capital gains tax have made a huge difference across decades of economic growth.

Yes Robertson and Ardern have been terrible for NZ particularly future generations, but what is the solution now that they are gone?

Does NZ have more beneficiaries than Aussie? If not then that may not be the problem. How does our welfare spend compare to them as a percentage of GDP?

[Getty]

I didn't think there was anything wrong with the interview.
Treachery 🤣 Tame's job is to ask tough questions and he did, he could've really got stuck in regarding sheepgate.
McClay handled himself well & it was a good robust interview, but perhaps you think the media should go soft on the Government,

Naivety of the highest order.
It's one thing to ask a question that's not in NZ's international interest, but to persist several times to get a different answer, when McClay has given an adequate diplomatic answer, is unpatriotic on Tame's part.

Who is he serving?

Imagine if Tame got the answer he tried so hard to get, then it was broadcast on Chinese and Indian news!

Very damaging to NZ.

[Daytr]

Naivety of the highest order.
It's one thing to ask a question that's not in NZ's international interest, but to persist several times to get a different answer, when McClay has given an adequate diplomatic answer, is unpatriotic on Tame's part.

Who is he serving?

Imagine if Tame got the answer he tried so hard to get, then it was broadcast on Chinese and Indian news!

Very damaging to NZ.

So you are saying our foreign policy can't be questioned. We aren't in China thank goodness.

For the record Tame game Swarbrick an even harder time.

[Getty]

If Tame had his way, and NZ's trade suffered as a result, imagine the gloating and derision against the Government from the ilk of Bentdick Collins, Sharman, Lynch & co!

[Bjauck]

Naivety of the highest order.
It's one thing to ask a question that's not in NZ's international interest, but to persist several times to get a different answer, when McClay has given an adequate diplomatic answer, is unpatriotic on Tame's part.

Who is he serving?

Imagine if Tame got the answer he tried so hard to get, then it was broadcast on Chinese and Indian news!

Very damaging to NZ.so Tame should have exerted control over his pursuit of free expression, for the supposed common political and economic good? Sounds a bit commie to me.

[Getty]

so Tame should have exerted control over his pursuit of free expression, for the supposed common political and economic good? Sounds a bit commie to me.
You may couch it that way if you wish.

The reality is that our trading partners don't adhere to puritanical politics or media transparency.

TV's production teams who compile questions for interviews of our Trade diplomats should give more consideration
to what's at stake, and interviewers such as Tame should take the hint to move on when answered, rather than try to elicit a damaging response.

Do what's good for NZ Inc, not personal egos and point scoring.

[mistaTea]

You may couch it that way if you wish.

The reality is that our trading partners don't adhere to puritanical politics or media transparency.

TV's production teams who compile questions for interviews of our Trade diplomats should give more consideration
to what's at stake, and interviewers such as Tame should take the hint to move on when answered, rather than try to elicit a damaging response.

Do what's good for NZ Inc, not personal egos and point scoring.

Have to disagree with you there.

I never saw this interview, but if Tame was unfairly biased etc that is one thing.

However, what other countries may or may not think is not his concern. He is free to ask anything and, in fact, we rely on media to ask the hard/uncomfortable questions to hold those in power to account.

It is up to the minister to navigate those questions carefully.

I am very critical of the MSM when I see (what I perceive as) one-sided or biased reporting.

But I would be even more horrified if I thought journalists were not asking hard questions on the basis that they are scared to upset an overseas leader.

[Ferg]

Dann said superannuation and CGT are some of the key factors in why New Zealand is “languishing” compared to our transtasman neighbours. “For me, there are two key things Australia has that we don’t. Compulsory superannuation savings and a capital gains tax have made a huge difference across decades of economic growth.
I think Dann missed the biggest of them all being the resources that have been dug out of the Australian ground for multiple decades. I find it somewhat telling.....

[Bjauck]

You may couch it that way if you wish.

The reality is that our trading partners don't adhere to puritanical politics or media transparency.

TV's production teams who compile questions for interviews of our Trade diplomats should give more consideration
to what's at stake, and interviewers such as Tame should take the hint to move on when answered, rather than try to elicit a damaging response.

Do what's good for NZ Inc, not personal egos and point scoring. What are “puritanical politics”?

Our trading partners have all sorts of politics, I certainly would hope that our media would operate according to the standards of a democratic country with media independence and transparency when conducting interviews with government ministers and representatives. I mean to say that was a criticism levelled by some National Party supporters against the previous Labour admin - that its media funding was buying media bias.

[Getty]

So, did the All Black's achieve greatness by playing as a squad of 25 individuals, or as a team?

[nztx]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/christopher-luxon-compares-labour-to-arsonists-in-firery-speech/JNHP4SVLIFBD7LAMZILHVMW5GQ/

PM Christopher Luxon compares Labour to arsonists in fiery speech



Prime Minister Christopher Luxon compared the Labour opposition to arsonists in a fire-heavy speech to supporters in Palmerston North this morning.

Luxon said that Labour’s questions to him each Parliamentary sitting week were “a bit like an arsonist returning to the scene of a fire that they started and then criticising the fire brigade for the means by which it is extinguishing the fire.


They probably don't know what a hose or ladder look like either after six years of p*ssing in the wind and hoping the wind didn't change direction to come back & soak them ;)

[Panda-NZ-]

The whole world is on fire then except Australia.

He doesn't apply the same logic to climate change only to numbers on a paper.

[Aaron]

I think Dann missed the biggest of them all being the resources that have been dug out of the Australian ground for multiple decades. I find it somewhat telling.....

He didn't miss it but rides rough shod over it with this paragraph.

“Yes, they have access to enormous mineral wealth. But to blame the difference on that alone is a cop-out. New Zealand is also blessed with outsize natural resources relative to its population.
“But per person, we have lower productivity and lower rates of savings and investment.”

I am not sure how dairy farming compares to iron ore extraction, it pays higher wages.

[Bjauck]

So, did the All Black's achieve greatness by playing as a squad of 25 individuals, or as a team? First, could you answer my previous question. What did you mean by “puritanical politics?”

I think the analogy of sports team with a country is over-simplified and an incorrect analogy. At a stretch, a sports team could be analogous to a platoon of soldiers facing an objective in a battle. There are also two Nations ahead of the All blacks in the rankings at the moment!